Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Phew - I will be at work !
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
I have to stop posting for tonight,i am going away to a UKIP meeting which takes place in the morning.Well I am not going now My mate can not go now because of work,and Scarborough is to far now for me to do it alone and back again and the cost of the fuel to.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
peter
not quite the answer peter
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,707
It is really simple folks
It is a sale of a business as a going concern (hopefully)
The normal sale process protocols will be followed once HMG makes its choice as to preferred bidder.
Then the bidder will go through a process of examining DHB books etc. to decide if it is really a going concern, whether they can make a sensible level of return on their investment over a sensible time period.
Given the disclosed accounts of DHB (£60m turnover generating £15m gross profit), it is a very good investment prospect for UK based Pension Funds particularly if the bonds carry a sensible/competitive interest rate over their duration. It is likely that a range of durations (5/10/15/20 years) will be used/offered to raise the funds, carrying different interest rates depending on duration. This is exactly the sort of thing Pension Funds love as it helps them plan sensible investment strategies to meet their future liabilities.
(I work for an Investment Management House - but not on the Investment side and cannot offer investment advise)
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
ross,which set of books are talking about.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
so many different figures being bandied about, alex on the front page quotes an honourable member saying that the profit was 25 million used oncers.
the turnover figure varies between 50 and 60 million depending on the source or dare i say it, vested interest.
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,707
Brian - the internal accounting records and books etc
Howard the numbers I quote are from the last set of published, audited accounts available on the DHB web site - without having access to their internal records this is the ONLY source available and is the official record used for reporting and tax purposes
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 673- Registered: 16 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,388
This is the bit which I have never understood and nobody has ever explained. The so-called "profits" are the excess of income over outgoings and are used to continuously improve and expand the port. Where does the pension company get its return from unless it uses this money, leaving nothing for further investment in the port and resulting in stagnation? Furthermore, where does the additional money come from that is supposed to be going to be invested in Dover and which is what this privatisation is all about?
"Modernising Trust Ports [second edition]: 1.4.1 Trust ports can expect to generate a significant return. In a private company, after deducting strategic investments and contingencies, that return would be distributed among shareholders in the form of a dividend. Trust ports, having no shareholders, must use any profits generated to support the long term viability of the port and thus for the benefit of the whole community of stakeholders."
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
As many of us have said Ed so many unanswered questions
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Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Ed - you need to catch up with the People Port - it will not be generating a profit to shareholders but to Dover Town instead.
As for financing, many a successful businessman will tell you that you use other peoples money to invest....
Investment is supposed to boost profits so borrowing to invest should more than pay for itself, generating more profit to be distributed to Dover's regeneration.
Face the facts, the old Port set up did not work for Dover Town. We have seen the town decline and decay for decade and to change that something radical has to be done. If we carry on the same way we will get the same results. The People's Port offers that change and a once in a lifetime opportunity.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
Please will you all take the time to read my post on the front page of last weeks meeting at the Town HALL on the sell of our port,I wuld like your views on it even if you do not agree with mine. thank You.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Vic, its not worth reading, it adds nothing intelligent to the discussion. There you have my view...
What have we all been doing, then?
Guest 703- Registered: 30 Jul 2010
- Posts: 2,096
I've read it.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,895
I have given up reading the front page at the moment it seems to be going round in circles a bit like this thread.
We all have our own opinion and all the arguements at the moment seem to be about things that have been discussed over and over again.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
Because I had to admit to myself that I was not giving the PP idea a fair go and basically I was acting like some others on here that I criticize, this is me coming clean.
Take away the people behind the idea and just looking at the idea. I have to say that it is an exciting way forward for the People of Dover/Deal, to actually own and have their own say in how it is run and share in the profits from that enterprise, it has to be a good idea. I think nearly everyone in the area would be for it, as I might be, if it was as straight forward as that.
The stumbling block for me and I presume many others, is mistrust. Mistrust of the people behind it. This is where i have to be honest and say that my mistrust is not in any way a personal attack on anyone but is based on past experience.
The first mistake was, in my opinion, that Mr Elphicke should have run his campaign on the back of this project, I am sure I will be told about timings being wrong etc but he could have come forward with it, as an idea and sowed the seeds. Since then it has been like pulling teeth from a dragon, trying to get important questions answered, which has only lead to more mistrust.
Obviously not all the questions have an answer at this early stage but it is the basic questions that have been avoided, such as who are the backers, certain financial figures and the important one for me was what you get for your £10.
It took months before we were informed that all you will get, for your tenner,
is a vote, A vote on what? Will the people of Dover/Deal be involved in the running of the scheme or will they even be given something to vote on?
It took months before two financial backers names came forward. I am told they reside in St Margaret's and Sandwich, I could be wrong but as they are both big overseas businessmen, I don't think their addresses comes into it much.
I still think our efforts would be better served in changing the Charter but if we have to accept that this Gov is going to sell our Port, then let's have straight answers to the many appropriate questions that are being asked. Maybe then, the trust might be more forthcoming, maybe then, more people might be happier about backing the project.
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Gary, going by my knowledge of the DHB plan and of the p/p plan, it would appear that, in both cases, any money for Dover would go to Dover, and not to Deal or any other part of the District, and that there is speciificly no mention of Deal or any other locality apart from Dover.
I am sure Neil can corrct me if this is not so, and as you are in Deal, it might serve your interest in all this to put the question over to Neil, or even Charlie Elphicke MP in person, for example by email.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
you're right alex it is only dover, the question is whether that is dover town electoral area or the remote frontier posts of dover like whitfield and river would be included.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
GARY
Yep these questions continue to be asked, and the concept of a community port no one would dispute
but like you say how, or even if it can be achieved is still questionable
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
