Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
3 November 2010
01:1778194#201
I think it is very clear about what is being offered by the Trust on behalf of their proposed stakeholders and why and how they propose to take the business forward for the benefit of those stakeholders.
A couple of web searches and a little additional reading then explained the bit about the level of consideration payable to HMG and what happened to the balance (
http://www.parliament.uk/briefingpapers/commons/lib/research/briefings/snbt-00010.pdf P7) and also the key items in MTP (
http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/shippingports/ports/trust/goodgovernancesecondedition.pdf)
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 November 2010
01:3378197#202
Any more of this rubbish, Ross, and we shall have to co-opt you onto the board!
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
3 November 2010
01:4178198#203
You never know I might even be interested
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
3 November 2010
02:0178203#204
I read the whole letter on the link. I asume this thread will be continuing for some time. I don't want to upset anyone here, but I would point out some points. Firstly, the 'community' that the self-proclaimed trust claims to represent does not include me! I never was consulted by the members of the self-appointed trust on the issues raised, and do not know of any Dover community having given their support to this 'port trust'.
Gov. did consult with us, and gave us the chance to send in representations.
As I already stated, Charlie should go back to the queue and await the outcome of Gov's consultations. There are in fact alternative proposals to DHB' sale proposal, that do not correspond to those of Charlie and his 'port-trust', and these are proposals that come from Dover's community.
I think Charlie should do a course 1 in maths at the Kent County library, he evidently doesn't seem to grasp that Dover's community could not cough up more than a few hundred thousand quid for a port that he values at 200 million of 'em.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
3 November 2010
07:2878205#205
Alexander - Lets just be grateful that Charlie is not listening to you.
Thanks Peter and Ross - excellent stuff.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 November 2010
09:1978226#206
Don't worry, Alexander, you are not upsetting me, at least, even if you are getting BarryW's dander up from time to time.
Interesting point you make about representations to the Government. I have a full transcript of all the representations which were made but the Govt redacted the names of those who made them. Which one was yours?
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
3 November 2010
11:2878254#207
One of them, Peter!
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 November 2010
13:0678268#208
Perhaps you would like to enlighten your fellow forumites as to the text of your representation, Alexander?
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
3 November 2010
14:3478275#209
This ridiculous coyness just makes you look shifty and foolish Alexander
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
3 November 2010
15:3178283#210
Peter, re your post #195 - good luck with the bid, winning this would be a great way to start off David Cameron's "The Big Society" and could be the start of the regeneration of Dover. As the Dover Harbour Board are determined to sell anyway, we should stand as much chance as any other bid.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
3 November 2010
15:5378286#211
I haven't revealed any information from the representations, Ross, as they are confidential. Anyone wishing to reveal their own information can do so, as Charlie has.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
3 November 2010
15:5878287#212
thnk as said all along I support this bid and couldn't give a hoot(polite term rather than what i want to put lol)
who makes the bid, lets hope the dosh is coughed up, and charlie s able to get hs sums right and do the best for Dover.
Whilst we not fully agree with alexander he has the right to have concerns, and just because we don't agree doesn't mean he's wrong
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
3 November 2010
16:1578289#213
Showing my lack of financial wizardry here
. Can some one explain the differance between the £400,000,000 head line consideration and the £200,000,000 net consideration???
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 November 2010
16:1778291#214
Thank you Keith, it's nice to see an independent-minded Labour man speak his mind.
Just because two people don't agree it doesn't mean that it is wrong for them each to try to make the other change his mind either. That is just what forum debates like this are for.
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 November 2010
16:1878293#215
Jimmy, it's all in the Ports Act 1991.
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
3 November 2010
16:1978294#216
Jimmy, under the Ports Act 1991 the Trust Port creates a limited company and passes the port activity and assets to the Company, it is then this Company that is sold the government then charges the Port Company a 50% levy on the proceeds of the sale, the remaining 50% staying with the Port company as working capital to allow the purchaser to run the business.
At least that was my understanding from the link I posted in post 201 above
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
3 November 2010
16:2078295#217
The difference between the 400 million and 200 million pound estimations are that the MP valued Dover's Port at 200 million pounds and effectively asked for it to be put up for sale at that price! Originally he had stated, while in opposition, that he was against Dover Port being sold!
This what it came to! That he wants to sell Dover Port for 200 million pounds!
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
3 November 2010
16:2178296#218
In that case, Ross, the MP wants to sell Dover Port at 400 million pounds, just as DHB wants to!
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
3 November 2010
16:2278297#219
Alexander please read my post 201 and the links in it and my post 216 explaining it to Jimmy.
The port is worth what someone will pay for it.
As a commercial business, sales values are worked out on multiples of profit or sometimes turnover - this sale is a valued at a 20 times multiple of the annual profit of the port, namely £20m which suggests the investors will break even after 20 years which in my view and experience is a fair value for this business. The underlying land values are irrelevant in terms of the business sale and only become relevant if the business sells land in the 10 years after the sale when the government charges an additional levy, as detailed in the Ports Act.
If you have not taken the time to understand the governing legislation, it is no wonder you do not want to discuss your representations to HMG
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
3 November 2010
16:4578311#220
