howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
All local parties are like that, street stalls are all good and well but they are there primarily to boost each party's local supporters and only tell them the bits they want to hear.
Only Rippers and Watty lower themselves to post to us plebs on local forums.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,875
Nothing to worry about we will hear plenty from all parties nearer election time.
Strange but for some reason they all seem to come out of the woodwork about that time, bombarding us with useless information about how we need to vote for them.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
Yes it is the best way tell the public and tell them they are welcome to the meetings we even had food ready for them
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
U.K.I.P. IS WASHED UP. I think by the end of the year there will be no party if we stay in it will be for ever if we come out UKIP will have no mandate .And their leader will take a soft blue ward .U,K.I.P have done very well and without them we might not have had the vote this year, but it is hard to find what roll they would play after the vote in or out is taken .But again just my view on how I see it.
Guest 943- Registered: 15 May 2013
- Posts: 449
Hi Vic.How's your bunker at the moment? Are still listening to Francis Rossi and Status Quo ? I know you used to be a fan in 2008.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Very witty Peter you are adept at asking questions but never answering those asked of you - must be your lifetime in politics showing through.
The very aim of UKIP was to get an EU referendum then close down whatever the result. Now you have these new improved management team that you refuse to name that will be out of a job in just over 3 months. Most of your big hitters that took a bashing back in May don't seem interested any more.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
Mr Ripley the story about Francis Rossi is history now but it will come up again in my life story being told on the forum but what that has to do with UKIP I do not know ,if it was to try and show me up you are wasting your name because I do not care sir.But as the post is saying above and I asked to what Roll to you see UKIP taking on after the vote ,the way I see it there will not be a roll in or out .
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,299
One assumes that UKIP will cease to exist in any meaningful way post referendum.
If the result is to remain, then the question is done and dusted for another, well, umpteen years; if the result is to leave, then their work will be complete - they can pat themselves on the back and get on with the day job.
Regardless of your views, they have turned politics on its head - amazingly with only one (?) elected MP!
Reginald Barrington
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 17 Dec 2014
- Posts: 3,257
I think giving ukip the credit is entirely wrong, its the British public who have been demanding change and the referendum.
Arte et Marte
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
Well locally we have three UKIP councillors and one has very good coverage in today's Dover Mercury.He is or working for his ward.I also saw another UKIP Councillor at the film festival.Dover still has UKIP Councillors.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
3 as far as i know, Andrew Richardson who has started to get involved with the Clarendon and Westbury Community Association, Georgette Rapley who did not get involved with the pier or WDRP despite it being in her ward and Ben Glayzer who is now keeping his nose clean.
John Buckley
- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
Re post # 29
Not quite sure how you come to that conclusion Reg?
If you rightly believe that it's the British public that has been demanding the referendum but apparently nothing to do with UKIP, then perhaps you should consider why in fact large numbers of the public are actually now demanding change?
Do you really think that any of the so called three main political parties have particularly gone out of their way in the past to actually inform and advise the electorate about the numerous ills of the EU?
Without any doubt and like it or not, if it was not for UKIP and its members putting in the time effort and money into informing the public of the true situation regarding our membership of this costly and corrupt establishment club then most people would still be oblivious as to why we desperately need to leave.
It is surely obvious that without the threat posed by UKIP at the last election Dave would never have offered in a million years a referendum in the first place. As we know, he was simply backed into a corner and had no option but to propose holding a referendum purely and only to negate the perceived and genuine threat from UKIP.
In my view, it's quite obvious that without the presence of UKIP we would not be holding a referendum on our EU membership this coming June.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Welcome back John fully agree that UKIP or more to the point Farage got us this referendum but they will not win it without respected politicos from the two big parties fronting the "Out" campaign.
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,299
UKIP changed the landscape because the Conservative Party feared a mass exodus of voters would join UKIP. That, combined with the constant lobbying of the right wing Tory element (Cash, Bone, Hollobone, Fabricant etc.) meant that the PM became boxed in as he didn't want to appear too pro Europe and didn't really have anywhere to go. By the time he, well, grew a pair and decided to take on Farage, the damage was done.
Fast forward and we are where we are; a referendum the PM never really wanted. No other political party was calling for it either. As it happens, I think he has done a fairly decent job in the changes he has got in negotiation. There was never going to be a treaty change, certainly not one that would have been done before the now legally binding referendum date.
I hope we choose to remain in - but my fear is that those who want to leave the EU, really do mean it and will vote en masse. Those who are pro Europe, tend not to share the same passion and may not bother. So, on a ridiculously low turn out, we will leave the EU and everyone will turn around, scratching their heads, saying "how on earth did that just happen..."
John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
Thank you Howard, I have a bit more time on my hands now, unfortunately my wife has had to return to Thailand as her dad's seriously ill in hospital.
But you are quite right, UKIP would be unlikely to win the referendum on it's own, but as you know there are now some big players batting for the leave side. Shame that there's not many from labour or the lib dims but that's to expected I guess!
Neil's also correct about the lobbying of some of the Tory right wing which of course prompted Dave to tell them to "stop banging on about Europe"! Fortunately they did keep banging on and although an annoyance to him he more or less kept the dissenters under control but the general election was the final straw whereupon he had to acknowledge the threat from UKIP and concede to the promise of a referendum.
Basically, if UKIP didn't exist, would Dave have given in to the Tory rebels, personally I don't think so.
As for Dave's "reformed" European Union, that surely has to be the joke of the year.
He asked for virtually nothing of any significance and got even less!
Funny how we all see things differently though!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Cameron's reforms count for nothing words were exchanged in the hope that we would all vote to remain but no real changes are on the horizon. The main parties worry about dissenters in their ranks when they ought to be more concerned about dissenters amongst their voters. Neil refers to the mass exodus of Tory voters to UKIP but Labour suffered the most in marginal seats. I would still like to hear a clear cases detailing the benefits of staying in.
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,299
Yes, Howard, it is funny how for all the PM's fear, it was actually Labour voters who tended towards UKIP rather than Tories.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
all part of the master plan,to keep Britain in.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Well Neil it was only a real to surprise the big shots of the two main parties who didn't really understand their core supporters. Many of the tory voters are self employed or run small businesses where red tape from the EU ties them down but wouldn't vote Labour out of principle/life long habit/SNP. In 2010 Labour lost seats in the safe North because of low wages and community break ups caused by free movement of labour from the EU. Lessons weren't learned and things got markedly worse in 2015.
Using natural logic both tory and labours would benefit in different ways by voting no in June, I suspect that won't happen because most people under 40 don't remember life before the EU and will believe that all the good things in life nowadays come from them.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
I note that John as well as Peter have refused to name the new dream team that will take UKIP to new heights.