ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
Reginald Barrington wrote:There would be no point in wasting my time and energy arguing the against the validity of his arguments when I have no knowledge in the field, just as much as I would not waste my time and energy arguing for the imperial college teams advice that the government Is following.
Curious when you seem to be so keen on ridiculing and belittling the arguments of others in this thread.
Captain Haddock
- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 8,167
£330 billion bail out just announced (which is £11,000 per UK taxpayer).
"We are living in very strange times, and they are likely to get a lot stranger before we bottom out"
Dr. Hunter S Thompson
Reginald Barrington
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 17 Dec 2014
- Posts: 3,259
ray hutstone wrote:Curious when you seem to be so keen on ridiculing and belittling the arguments of others in this thread.
What like:
"each machine needs 5 nurses and a doctor with 8 years training to operate."
"WORLD HEALTH ORGANISATION say what the f**k are you p***ks doing you are all going to die."
"4,000,000 people that WILL die on the first wave."
"we have already produced a vaccine that protects us against the virus."
"Yes he has sentenced us to death."
No not ridiculous at all.
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Arte et Marte
Guest 2756- Registered: 2 Aug 2018
- Posts: 42
Blah blah blah
Thank god somebody had given Boris a shake and informed him it would not be a good idea to deliberately infect the entire population of the country because we don’t have health facilities to deal with that. We can’t suppress the spike either to gradually roll it out. DURRR
Only deliberately infected 50-100,000 of us before the blatantly idiot proof obvious came into focus and the rest of the entire worlds concerned screams were heard.
And Boris was by far the smartest of the graduates a true leader!!
Guest 2756- Registered: 2 Aug 2018
- Posts: 42
Somebody may shake him harder later today, who knows, and he may strike the chord and realise that children will catch the virus easily and take it home to their parents DURRR.
They have to create their legacy somehow to keep their ego afloat.
Guest 2756- Registered: 2 Aug 2018
- Posts: 42
Won’t start massive drive to test people hey chaps cos I reckon u would need to be a rocket scientist with the full experience of something that has never happened before to work that out.
I would suggest our medical card team may be a place to look at first!!
Guest 2756- Registered: 2 Aug 2018
- Posts: 42
As the purse strings begin to loosen and the trillions of pounds that have been denied the working classes and our services during austerity begin to flutter away, the corporate giants and privatised greedy pigs begin to shed their tears along with their m.p companions.
The great citizens of our nation will be able to relax when the purse fully opens to put their health and wealth and the top priority thus bringing the fat cat giants to their knees.
Maybe at the other end the working classes will once again be appreciated for their talented skills.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 8,167
Maybe at the other end the working classes will once again be appreciated for their talented skills.
"We are living in very strange times, and they are likely to get a lot stranger before we bottom out"
Dr. Hunter S Thompson
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
Same old, same old Reggie. But not a good deflection (as if yours ever were). I'm not going to comment on our friend's Laboliques' remarks. I haven't done thus far and I'm sure he's quite capable of arguing his own corner even if the hyperbole runs a bit high at times.
The point I made concerned the modelling behind the government's decision to opt for a 'herd immunity' strategy. Quite specifically, I posted a short video by Mike Galsworthy questioning how viable a single strategy based on this would prove to be. Dr Mike Galsworthy is an independent consultant in research and innovation policy and a visiting researcher at London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine (LSHTM). Previous to that he worked at UCL & the Royal College of Anaesthetists. Mike’s undergraduate degree is from Cambridge (Natural Sciences, 1st class) and PhD from Kings’ College London (behaviour genetics).
But, hey, he is also founder of Scientists for EU. So in wades Reggie, effectively saying that I posted the article because I am known to have been a supporter of the UK's continuing membership of the EU. Presumably for that reason my points were worthless.
Rather belittling and ridiculing isn't it simply to dismiss something because it happens to emanate from a source you disagree with? The fact that the vast majority of UK scientists are unwavering in their objections to our leaving the UK has probably escaped your attention. You then went to ask rather sneeringly what modelling I would choose. Well, we now know of course that the 'herd immunity' model has been hastily dropped in favour of suppresion. Other issues raised in Mike's article remain important - the absence of a coherent testing strategy, the lack of critical equipment - but that's too long a debate to have here.
The point is that this is quite literally a deadly serious matter. Government policy has to be scrutinised thoroughly and not lamely accepted because it offends ideology or dogma. If you don't want a grown up debate then that's fine by me. Probably best all round if I go back into hibernation.
Bob Whysman
- Registered: 23 Aug 2013
- Posts: 1,938
Naughty boy Reginald putting facts on a fictional thread!!
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Do nothing and nothing happens.
Weird Granny Slater
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,087
Not so. At least, not while it's still voluntary.
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
Bob Whysman- Registered: 23 Aug 2013
- Posts: 1,938
Weird Granny Slater wrote:Not so. At least, not while it's still voluntary.
They’ve only mentioned the possible confinement of the over 70’s so far WGS ..........so perhaps this will work on a sliding scale so the over 80’s restriction will follow on later!
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Do nothing and nothing happens.
Bob Whysman- Registered: 23 Aug 2013
- Posts: 1,938
Laboliques, I was concerned that your posting times indicated that you were waking up with a rant on your mind....not good for your blood pressure.
Then I realised that it was difficult to join the W W net in some countries and to circumvent this you would need to covertly use a VPN.
Do nothing and nothing happens.
Weird Granny Slater- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,087
Bob Whysman wrote:They’ve only mentioned the possible confinement of the over 70’s so far WGS ..........so perhaps this will work on a sliding scale so the over 80’s restriction will follow on later!
Excellent logic, BW. Mine is this: I'm in the 60s. I'll never be over the 70s (glam, loons, Neu!, punk, marches, muddy festivals, etc.), and I couldn't get into the 80s, let alone the 90s. That might save me.
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
#30 - wrong. Fiction on a factual thread (unless, of course, you believe that anything said by a pro-European is, by definition, wrong).
Reginald Barrington- Location: Dover
- Registered: 17 Dec 2014
- Posts: 3,259
Ray I have clearly expressed that I am not knowledgeable enough about the subject to be able to comment for or against a particular strategy.
My guess would be neither are you or any other members of this forum, I am however knowledgeable enough about how ventilators operate,
how the WHO do not use such language,
That 4 000 000 will not die in the 1st wave,
That there is not yet a vaccine
Or that anybody has been given a death sentence.
My suggestion that you have selected a scientist that fits your anti government position and just happens to support you anti brexit stance is probably pure coincidence, these things happen.
It doesn't change the fact however that I do not know wether he is right or imperial college team are right so how can i sensibly debate it?
Though I'm not entirely certain Dr Mike's CV qualifies him either.
Arte et Marte
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
just waiting for Russia, china and the yanks to start lobbing nuclear missiles at each other with us poor sods in the middle of it.
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,707
Lets be clear Imperial are one of a number of academic teams that are running epidemiological models on Coronavirus; many of these models are in the same ball-park as the Imperial one. Like all good forecasters they used their model to predict a range of outcomes based not only on different strategies but also on different amounts of testing, different levels the health services could ramp up capacity to etc. these were presented to the relevant government teams to be used as inputs to their decision making. These models are re-run regularly as further data sets become available from scientists around the world. There is still a lot we do not know, or is very unclear so they cannot be included in the models - yet! These include the role or otherwise of children/teens as carriers, the real efficacy of various lengths of isolation period (7/14/more days) in reducing transmission, whether you can re-catch it, what medicines are effective in treating the symptoms and which exacerbate them etc.etc.
One of the models was based on a "do nothing at all" approach and indeed suggested as many as 2.5m deaths, but this has never been one of the strategies pursued by HMG. The current approach when modelled suggest a potential death toll in the 10's of thousands, this for many is too many but realistically from a population of 60+million this is low. In fact based on the latest models and representations from scientists and doctors the government will be further ramping up testing.
As the Imperial rep said on the Today programme there is a fine line and balance between the health and wellbeing of our citizens and the economic health of our nation, take measure that are too draconian and we will have a decimated economy at the end of this do too little and the population will be decimated severely hampering our ability to work out of the inevitable recession post Coronavirus.
Anyway lets all buckle up and enjoy the ride as it is going to get bumpy for a while
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"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
Button
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 22 Jul 2016
- Posts: 3,065
It appears, sadly, that people get killed on our roads; the provisional figure for the 12 months ending June 2019 was 1,870:
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-road-casualties-in-great-britain-provisional-estimates-year-ending-june-2019. Reckon I'm going to have to stock-up on something and at least keep my distance from other drivers - if, in fact, I don't just stay indoors until the risk has passed.
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(Not my real name.)