Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
peter,a consensus of willingness and a bit of foresight it would work,the euro currency would a basic right for all of us.
alan,if thats the american 101 you are having a laugh arnt you,about much use as a wet paper bag.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Brian the Euro is an attempt to defy gravity, no amount of willingness or foresight can achieve that.
As for basic rights - well, we have the right to commit suicide, let's join the Euro and do it as a nation.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
We all know that the Government won't introduce the euro here.
But if the euro span out of control, it would badly damage Europe and even us. Some eurozone countries will be - would already have been - without cash if they hadn't been bailed out, and had substantial parts of their debt bought by the Central European Bank.
The ECB is currently buying up masses of Italian debt (bonds), and probably Spanish debt too.
My guess is, the German Wolfgang Schauble (CDU), who is a member of Ms. Merkels administration, was only jesting when he said the other day that Britain must join the euro.
It would be as suicidal for us to join the euro as it would be for Germany to do what Dave and Osborne were asking them to do only last week.
Of-course Wolfgang knows this. The Germans are trying to get the message over to us that neither side (London and Berlin) must push the other over the edge, that one must not tell the other what to do.
It's because the situation is serious: some European countries would fall into chaos if Germany and France hadn't payed massive sums into them to save them.
We would have by now revolution and mass disorder in some countries, or a military take-over, if they had just been left to run out of cash.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
alex,there is an answer to your post #23,but its to long and not forum famly friendly.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
we need to accept no govtnot even this cobbled together one lol)
are pushing to get out of the EU
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Keith, politicians in all EU countries see a glittering future as a euro-commissioner on huge salary and perks, once they have been found out by their own voters. They even call it 'doing a Kinnock'. So many of our leaders stress the danger of jumping from the frying pan into the fire should we get out.
Alex you are right that in many countries there is no popular pressure to get out. Why would a French farmer or a Spanish fisherman want his country to leave? Or anyone in one of the poorer countries which are the recipients of our generosity?
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
peter;
im neither pro nor anti the eu
not been convinced by either of the arguments
that said we need to get our head round no govt
not even our daves has any intention of leaving the eu
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
yes the commission is a plush rest home for our failed politicians, no doubt the same applies to other member states too.
alex mentions the lack of public disorder in the debt ridden countries, not true as greece and to a lesser extent spain and portugal have shown.
austerity measures are yet to kick in with italy, watch the fur fly when they do.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Certainly there has been public disorder in Greece, Howard, and in Italy too. But how much worse would it get in a country economically bankrupt - where the cash runs out if no bail out comes through - if other countries hadn't pumped in enormous quantities of cash?
But for how long can some states continue piling up money to lend out? Greece has even been excempted from paying back 50% of what it owes European banks.
And yet, these same banks are running low on money.
You rightly point out that austerity measures still have to take effect in Italy. I assume that Germany's government has emergency plans to pump more money to Italy should things get out of hand economically.
But the less money they lend (or give away), the heavier the austerity measures in Italy would have to be, and the more likely people would kick off in the streets.
The same applies to Spain and Portugal.
In other words, Germany and France are doing all they can to prevent full-scale riots and disorder breakinhg out all over southern Europe.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#27. Keith, that fence must be getting mighty painful to sit on for so long.....
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Another one from Reg
from Schrank of The Independent
***********************************************************
``Merkle;......Next......
Flashman; ...Can we keep this between us..?....the 81 group..plus...are watching my every move!!!!!! ```
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
peter'
rarely sit on the fence on any issues
but it goes to show how poor the arguments are from both sides thus unable to support either viewpoint
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Keith, are you quite alright?
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Sarkosy wrongfoots Cameron as he calls for a Two Tier Europe.
Cameron visits Sarkosy today to try to drive a wedge between Sarkosy and Merkle.............he will not succeed!
Sarkosy & Merkle meet on monday to guarantee europes Future and a new European Treaty.
Any new EU Treaty would be difficult for Cameron to `sell`to his Conservative colleagues.
If EU Leaders,meeting next week, approve the Franco/German plan Cameron will be under enormous pressure from his
eurosceptics............the message is clear Intergrate or Separate..........the 81 Group may get their way by default.
Although Cameron will resist their demands,the Treaty would still have to be approved by the commons and house of
Lords.There lies another confrontation within the Coalition.
Cameron`s dithering in communicating his belief in Europe has caused confusion/annoyance with both Europe and his
Party.
Another Error of Judgement.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
the french and german governments certainly seem to be distancing themselves from the rest of europe.
not a great deal that dave can do irrespective of the splits on this issue in his party.
Guest 656- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,262
Or indeed irrespective of the splints that Keith might encounter if he ever does become a fence sitter
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
Well all this is going to help UKIPnext time round what is happing today they forcast some years ago.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Eurozone.........Merkle &Sarkosy tell 27...........put up or shut up.............or we go with 17.
Treaty is enroute.
Cameron out of his depth....his dithering on Europe has not helped his Party or Europe or us.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Cameron is too worried about the coalition falling apart and knows that Clegg will spit out the dummy if DC goes too Eurosceptic. But Clegg must be terrified because if he pulls out of the coalition there will be an early election at which the GlibDems will be annihilated, and his leadership will be over.
Cameron must stop listening to Clegg and the civil servants, and hear what his rank and file and grass roots are saying.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
dave's cover is blown on this one, sarkozy wants a whole new treaty by march.
there would have to be a referendum on it, our politicos have all wormed out in the past by saying that changes were only amendments.
