Button- Location: Dover
- Registered: 22 Jul 2016
- Posts: 2,907
According to the BBC: "EU leaders were also questioning the logic of arguing over things like a customs union or Common Market option at this stage, because right now, the UK has only three options as they see it - no deal, no Brexit or Theresa May's deal - and anything else is a matter for future talks once the UK has actually left."
I sometimes wonder why we collectively voted to swap that kind of clear-thinking for our own brand.
I could write more, but I have some deckchairs to rearrange.
Weird Granny Slater, ray hutstone, Paul M and
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(Not my real name.)
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
Indeed, Button. The logical, sensible and consistent approach taken by the EU is in such contrast to our tin pottery throughout. But hey, "they need us more than we need them" etc.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
if it aint broke don't fix it.
ray hutstone likes this
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
Did anyone else hear that bloated buffoon Mark Francois being interviewed live on Radio 4's 10 o'clock news last night after the indicative votes had been announced ? He concluded the interview by shouting "I've got a message for you, Hammond, - up yours!"
The knuckledraggers may still get their way. It's the same old song after all these years. Nothing - not the country, not our youth, not even their own God forsaken party of all incompetents - will stop them from severing all our relationships from Europe with a huge V-sign.
I'm old now. This is the first time I have felt genuinely ashamed of my country's behaviour.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Francois is one of many MPs that have shown themselves up over the EU issue and I suspect that more will show their lack of quality in the weeks and months to come. Will be interesting to see the number of resignations after the current cabinet punch up and I reckon that Hammond will come out unscathed. Principles can get forgotten when £20 billion to spend on vital public services in a probable General Election year concentrates the minds.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,658
I am totally p***ed of with the self serving lot up in Westminster now May's pals
are after another extension, I just hope the EU refuse.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47794235-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Cunning stuff from the PM trying to lumber Corbyn with the blame after locking her Ministers in for 9 hours and confiscating their phones. The offer is still the same as in November so pointless in having discussions with a done deal(or no deal). More time wasted for all involved especially businesses and their staff but great for companies on large retainers from the taxpayers.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
election, referendum and a revoke before may the 1st.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
The Tories tearing themselves apart after their antichrist is brought in to take the blame for things going so badly wrong. Rather pointless in my view as the PM, Corbyn and most importantly the EU all have their red lines so no faustian pact is likely to take place, negotiations will break down very quickly.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,658
Seems a pointless exercise. I always got the impression that if May and her pals said yes, regardless of the subject, Corbyn and his pals would say no and visa versa.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
I think the Tory party is about to tear itself in half. Pour another cup of coffee, pull up a chair and watch with interest!
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
#3911 - Beware of what you wish for, Jan. That said, I do agree that it's looking increasingly unlikely that the EU will put up with our indecision any longer.
# 3916 Neil - Brexit is a Tory invention which became a Tory fantasy and is now a Tory disaster. I might watch with interest but the end result will make us all so much poorer in so many ways. Such a pity there is no opposition.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
there is ray, to Brexit that is. seems a non starter to me.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Courtesy of the Times.
In pure British political terms Theresa May’s decision to reach out to Jeremy Corbyn is perplexing.
Having made an independent free trade policy the centrepiece of her Brexit sunny uplands pitch, to abandon it now in an effort to win Labour votes runs counter to everything we know about the prime minister. But equally, if it is just a stunt designed to demonstrate that Mr Corbyn can’t be trusted to work in the national interest then the downsides of such a gambit are considerable. The howls of outrage from Conservative Brexiteers who reluctantly backed Mrs May’s deal last week are not confected. By pivoting so late in the day Mrs May has left herself dangerously exposed on all sides.
But there are compelling, less party political reasons why the prime minister’s gambit may be sensible.
The first is that the prime minister badly needs some breathing space. There are real fears in No 10 that European leaders could reject a long extension request next week and increase the likelihood of a no-deal Brexit. The EU simply cannot understand why the prime minister has not reached out across party lines before now. They’ve never understood the adversarial nature of Westminster politics, which is so different to that on the continent, and cannot comprehend why in such a national crisis all sides seem so unwilling to talk and compromise. By reaching out to Mr Corbyn the prime minister is sending a message to Europe that an extension might result in something more than further can-kicking. But perhaps more significantly, and often overlooked, is the fact that the political declaration for a future relationship that the prime minister agreed to last year is less far from Labour’s Brexit policy than meets the eye.
On the question of a customs union it states that both sides will put in place “ambitious customs arrangements” in pursuit of “having a trading relationship on goods that is as close as possible”.
It adds that both parties “envisage comprehensive arrangements that will create a free trade area, combining deep regulatory and customs co-operation, underpinned by provisions ensuring a level playing field for open and fair competition”. On the question of Labour demands for Britain to continue to align with all new EU environmental and labour rights law, the political declaration is even more specific. It commits the UK to aligning with existing and future regulations covering “state aid, competition, social and employment standards [and] environmental standards” under the so-called “level playing field” provisions. One government source put it this way: “We can’t say this but if you look at the political declaration you could argue that we’ve signed up to a customs union in all but name anyway.”
The source added the big difference was Labour’s demand that the UK had a seat at the table in the negotiation of future EU-wide trade deals. “We don’t think Brussels will offer that. But that is their problem not ours.” In an attempt to narrow the difference at policy level the talks are likely to involve officials as well as politicians. Labour for the first time will have their hands dipped in the “blood” of what is deliverable and what isn’t. Of course, for the obvious political reasons, a compromise is still much less likely than continued deadlock. But if it buys some time from Europe and opens a process of dialogue then it is probably worth a try. And as Mrs May knows, if she can get a deal through the House of Commons then putting the Conservative Party back together again won’t be her problem.
Weird Granny Slater- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 2,850
Abandoned by the cowardly beery woodcutter and his wife, their trail of breadcrumbs eaten by the common birds, Leaver Remainer and her brother Remainer Leaver are trapped in the house of cake. Will they be eaten by the wicked witch, Moggy, or can they discover the goodies and escape to the path through the forbidding Euro-forest to the duck's back? Keep tuned for the next episode of this grim tale of political folk in fairyland.
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
Genius line from No.10 spokesperson on how difficult it'll be to get Theresa May to agree to a Customs Union: "The Government's position is to have a Customs Union but not to call it a Customs Union, Jeremy Corbyn's position is to not have a Customs Union but to call it a Customs Union".
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Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,500
In the words of the late Professor Joad "It all depends on what you mean by a Customs Union"
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Pablo- Registered: 21 Mar 2018
- Posts: 614
Can we have Schrödinger’s Customs Union then?
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
The editor of the Spectator which is the major cheer leader for the Tories is of the opinion that anything cooked up and agreed by May and Corbyn will spell the end of the party, sounds a bit over dramatic to me.