Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
2 January 2011
17:2587288A bigger problem Roger is the rents which Enterprise and other pubcos charge. All is negotiable of course but after Jack left the Horse, Enterprise were asking £45,000 a year rent. Add that to £7,000 in business rates and you have to make £1,000 a week profit just to be there. Then there's staff costs, heating, electricity, licensing costs, etc. Of course the pubcos take a sufficient upfront deposit to ensure that if your business fails, they still make money out of you.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
2 January 2011
17:3187292Well there you have it from a man who knows, that is alot of cash to find and it is the winter that they find hard and the winter weeks are more then the summer ones.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
2 January 2011
17:3687294Yes Peter, of course they are very important factors - critical even. Goes to show how short-sighted the chains are.
If nothing changes by the pub companies, then things will only get worse and even more pubs will close.
Roger
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
2 January 2011
17:4387299The blame for the slow and painful death of the traditional English pub will eventually be laid at the door of Enterprise, Punch, Wetherspoons and the supermarkets which sell alcohol at prices designed to undermine all other types of outlet.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
2 January 2011
17:5087306I don't know about eventually Peter, I thought it was now (they are being blamed).
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
2 January 2011
19:5687353a shrewd manager stuck with buying over priced stuff from the brewery might decide to under order each time and then purchase top up wines and spirits from a supermarket.
not that i am suggesting that any local pub resorts to this.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
2 January 2011
20:0987357That could end up with them going to jail Howard they can not do that .
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
2 January 2011
20:3087360It is against the rules of their tenancy, so they daren't (shouldn't) do that - some do of course.
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
2 January 2011
20:4887368perish the thought roger, i would never advocate anyone breaking the rules to keep their business going and a roof over their head!!
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
2 January 2011
21:0487376What's this Advocaart! Yeuch! All 'snowbols' to me
As if they would, of course they they should pay the astronomical prices as stipulated by their employer, one thing I didn't realise was that the pubco demand such an upfront deposit.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
3 January 2011
08:1387397It's a tough game running a pub, even for "un-tied" Free-houses like Blakes.
Now we're in 2011, the beers (and the wines and spirits etc.) are going up even further; many will put their prices up and then there's the VAT to 20% - about 7p per pint, based on £3.00 a pint now. If you look at it that it's an extra 1p per sip, not too bad.
Roger
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
3 January 2011
08:1687398it's bad roger, that is if your lucky-y enough to be able to afford it.
then theres all the other increases about to hit us
so i realise these are hard times for everyone
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,883
3 January 2011
11:0987445Howard, re #26, this was going on way back in the 60's when pubs were tied to breweries, then it was mainly on the spiriits side as they were easier to transport. I know this because my father-in-law did it and they were stored in his wardrobe, BTW so did the vast majority of his publican friends.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
3 January 2011
11:2587449Nowadays the pubcos and brewers have far more control. They can see what you are selling via your electronic tills; they know what you are buying as you order it all through them; and they have beer line monitors in your cellar which send real-time information back on how much is being pumped. Any discrepancies and they are down on you like a ton of bricks. Every which way they have you by the short and curlies, that is why we would never consider a tied arrangement. God knows it's tough enough as a free house, I don't know how the tied tenants manage.
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
3 January 2011
11:4087452Just reflecting on our personal history of the White Horse and we had some very good parties there...one in particular on a warm summer night on the terraces when yours truly was ermmm 39!! (60)
I have plenty of photographs of glamourous females but chose to remember the occasion with this one..
Take a look at these guys.....desperadoes all, some say they were part of the James gang but we couldnt confirm it at the time...
Just in case anyone doesnt know who they are..David H(annent) Businessman and Current Deputy Mayor. Thomas Guzzler Mitchell truck driver and ex Military Man, Keith Sansum Leading labourite and former Councillor. Howard McSweeney Top Man and Associate Editor of this fine organ.
All forumites to a man.
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
3 January 2011
13:4087495They're known Nationwide, 'the Original Wild Bunch', Big Aitch, Mad Mitch, San Sumo and Fingers McSweeney a force to be reckoned with
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
3 January 2011
14:0387506#21 From what Peter tells us above, it looks like legalised extortion to me, something like Chicago in the 1930s without the guns. Shame on these big boy outfits.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
3 January 2011
14:0587508the one on the right looks like the ringleader, criminality written all over him.
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
3 January 2011
14:1187511Yep, the Tattooist owed him one
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
3 January 2011
18:2187572Not following the one about the tattooist there but Im having a slow day.
As seems to be the case according to reports this is the last day around at The White Horse unless Jeanette can raise it from the ashes yet again at a later time. Hopefully she can, and overcome the economic problems as mentioned above in the previous posts.
We wish her the best of luck.
