Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
#16 - Keith, indeed, I said I would continue in the manner and purpose of this thread.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Diamond finally goes.There will be more to follow.
The whole affair is in need of a criminal investigation not Cameron`s half way measure of a select
Committee.
This is not a minor affair it must be dealt with by the top professional lawyers and justice personnel
so that the culture of Banking /Financial Sector is changed and controlled and the elite greedy pigs
removed.
It is thought that there are approx 200 culprits in 20 Banks.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
the view from our honourable member.
Charlie Elphicke: Although I welcome the Prime Minister's setting up thebanking review, does he agree that the real crime is that there is anydoubt at all that interest rate rigging is a criminal offence? If we areto have truth and reconciliation, should we not see a bit moreresponsibility and a bit less of the buck-passing that we have seen fromformer Labour Cabinet Ministers today?
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Charlie makes a good point. Libor is not a 'regulated' product or activity under the FSA'S rules. The obvious charge would be conspiracy to defraud- but to defraud whom? It would appear that Libor was rigged to keep interest rates artificially low so its not the borrowers who have lost out. It looks to me as if the victims are likely to be the banks themselves (other than the 16 or 20 who do the rate setting) professional investors in floating rate instruments and hedge funds who had leveraged positions in derivatives whose value depended on Libor.
I think our laws are probably insufficiently strong to make successful prosecutions likely. However many victims of the fiddled Libor scam are likely to be in the USA where your average 'Ohio dentist' deals in financial futures. Only a matter of time therefore before American state prosecutors dust off the RICO Act and lots of the City's finest join the NatWest Three.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
BarryW.
Can you advise me how to switch banks?
I have a large personal loan with Barclays that will need topping up soon, unemployed(wife's carer), are there any reputable banks left that would give me such a loan to pay off Barclays?
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
GaryC - You might find the Co-op Bank would meet your needs. You have to be careful though, being a loan there may be penalties for paying off the existing loan early. Get quotes and compare the costs of a new loan plus carrying on with the old one and a new smaller loan for the extra. You should take into account the terms of the loans as well as replacing the old one mid-term and substituting it with a new one over a longer period can be expensive. Clearly affordability of the payments will be a major factor for you not just the totals paid over the terms of loans. Feel free to bring the details to me to help with comparisons, a freeby of course, as I would not have any commercial risk. Good luck, I do not know your circumstances of course and, I am assuming, a genuine request.
Peter:
You are certainly right here and some asset managers, more specifically their (and by extension some of my) clients are the victims. But with interest rates being held down too low for too long it fed the housing boom adding to the 'bubble' that has burst so in a way we are all victims and those low interest rates helped no-one. Of course the BoE base rate being too low too long did not help either (Brown's inflation brief!) but we now see it is alleged that BoE executive and Treasury Ministers under Brown are also implicated in what seems to be an ever widening conspiracy.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
well done baz
lets get back to its all browns fault again
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Keith - I have just pointed out the facts. There are no excuses for the criminals but Brown did change the banking regulations so they could do this and it is alleged some of his Ministers were actively involved in the conspiracy.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
Usually when you resign from a job you lose all your rights to pension/pay off etc
so why would mr diamond and many more before him get big pay offs?
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
You can't blame Brown for the low base rate Barry, one of the things he did in 1997 was to remove the setting of rates from political control and leave it to the market and the BoE- an act for which he was widely applauded at the time.
It was the fragmentation of the BoE's regulatory function which let the fox into the henhouse because there were areas left without any agency tasked with their oversight. One of these was the setting of Libor. Pre 1997 I remember a number of occasions when a Libor was 'corrected' a few minutes after being set because the Old Lady had 'had a word' with a certain Japanese institution which used to set its Libor quotes unreasonably high.
Another perennial problem is that, with lamentably few exceptions, neither politicians, the media nor the general public have anywhere near the depth of knowledge or understanding about financial markets to make a value judgment based on the few facts which are in the public domain.
PS Bob Diamond was a typical over-promoted T-bond trader and salesman with a good grasp of man-management but (at least when he joined Barclays) no real knowledge of the City.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Peter - Brown set the BoE brief that ignored the levels of debt in the economy so he certainly was responsible. With the right brief the BoE would have taken into account the credit/housing boom in the rate setting and that would certainly have meant higher rates sooner.
By the way, yes Brown was praised for giving the BoE that role but some commentators did spot his failing in the brief at the time. But now it seems that Ministers were not as far out of the rate setting process as was first thought.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
In no way is this in defence of Bob Diamond,he is still in the top 10 of `elite greedy pigs list...but.....
In post # 1155 ( below... 1st July prior to his resignation ) on the `Elite Greedy Pigs` thread the
Guardian pointed out the involvement of the Bank of England and top Whitehall ` persons`and their
meetings with Barclays Bank.....5 years ago.........
It does indicate how endemic the elite greedy corruption could be and how it could have involved the
government at that time.
It does require a Judcial investigation.
Registered: Jun 2011
Posts: 1536
1 July 2012 - 4:24pm
#1155
Yes more Tories dragged into Banking Scandal...please do not say you are surprised.
# 1150...Micheal Spencer..now that supercilious,sanctimonious Conservative Deputy Chairman Micheal Fallon Board
member of ``another``Brokerage firm that `dominates the interest rates market.
Fallon `again` a close ally of Cameron and Senior member of commons Treasury committee ( wonder if he will declare an
`interest`)
******The Bank of England were aware of concerns over Libor 5 years ago ???? *****
Francis Maude member of Barclay`s Advisory committee from 2005 he received £ 9,200 for 15 hours work in 2009 .He
resigned prior to joining the Cabinet in 2010.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Neither Brown nor Alistair Darling are clever enough or well enough versed in matters financial to have come up with those ideas on their own. This was another case of mandarins and party advisors getting their way in true 'Yes Minister' style.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#33, if the Treasury/BoE turn out to be implicated I would be surprised. I can understand the Old Lady raising eyebrows at high Libor quotes but any admonishment ought to have meant 'put your house in order so as to repair your creditworthiness' rather than 'falsify your Libor submissions'. The latter would be like a policeman advising you to hold your finger on your speedometer to keep it reading 30, while you speed down the Folkestone Road at 60.
Over the years I have had many dealings with the Bank of England (admittedly not since they lost the regulatory functions) and in those years they would have come down like a ton of bricks on such a suggestion.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Peter #34 - of course you are right they are not clever enough and were advised. The problem is that they frequently ignored advice to go their own way as is well documented, over gold sales and over pension reform (more than once).
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Heavy ``point scoring going on chaps.................all governments are the same..all get tainted when they have the power
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Yes quite, Reg. I don't think Osborne is any more worldly-wise where the City is concerned.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Reg - you do make me laugh. Point scoring is all you are interested in and you do not like getting it back...
The problem is, for you - the government you supported were culpable, so there is a big case to answer.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Yes Barry they did lots of wrong things but a) so did the Tories -joining EMU for instance and b) what's the point in raking over the coals when there are more important things to do? Save the point scoring for PMQs.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
