Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Courtesy The Times................
Chaos grows as PM fails to placate Tories on EU vote
Tory MPs today called for ministers to back tomorrow's planned vote on an EU referendum
despite David Cameron's decision last night to table legislation immediately showing his
commitment to making a decision in the next Parliament. Eurosceptics backed Mr Cameron's
decision, the latest attempt to end the growing chaos in his party, as far as it went.
The Government is tabling a Bill today to enable a backbencher to pick it up and try to take through
the Commons using the private Member's legislation route. But rather than soften their demands
in response, the MPs called on ministers to come off the fence and back tomorrow's amendment
regretting the absence of legislation in the Queen's speech
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
its a case of yes,no,maybe and don't give a dam.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
Still find the whole situation strange
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
You and me both, Keith.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
Peter
Glad you understand where i'm coming from
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Courtesy The Times............
Tories at war as Eurosceptics reject Cameron's olive branch
Ministers expressed concern about the Prime Minister's authority being diminished
David Cameron ruled out further concessions to Conservative rebels on Europe last night as his
surprise embrace of an immediate referendum Bill threatened to fracture the party.
Eurosceptics demanded that Mr Cameron go further and, if necessary, bring down the coalition to write his promised
referendum into law. But Tory MPs in marginal seats criticised their colleagues for sounding "like a broken record"
on Europe and putting off voters.
Nicholas Soames the Eorophil Grandee said it was``offensive ``that some Eurosceptic MP`s did not take the Prime
Minister at his word over the referendum.It was a ``lunatic way of proceeding``for them to jump on Downing Street
concessions and demand more.``This game has to stop``he said..............
PS.Cameron is damaged......it would appear both major parties are trapped with leaders who are somewhat liabilities.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
MPs might naively take the prime minister at his word but the electorate won't.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
nigel farage must be lapping it all up, if i were him i would demand a firm date, the actual wording of the question and guaranteed equal media coverage of the pro and anti chaps.
would add also a limit on how much can be spent on the campaign.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
This rebellion is Cameron's Maastricht. He should have seen it coming
Every Tory leader should expect a revolt over Europe. But this time the rebels' anger goes much deeper
John Major shakes hands with Francois Mitterrand at the beginning of a European Community summit plagued by
quarrels over the Maastricht treaty.
The latest Tory rebellion over Europe is like an iceberg, which is why David Cameron has had to change course in
the face of it and promise to bring forward an EU referendum bill. What the prime minister can see - 70
backbenchers threatening to vote against the Queen's speech - is only a fraction of the obstacle. Hidden beneath
thesurface are more substantial opponents and wider causes of resentment.
Quite why this has turned into a potential shipwreck for the prime minister - hitting him as he was in Washington
trying to look statesmanlike - is an intriguing question. After all, if you don't have a plan for dealing with Europe
rebellions you really should not be in Cameron's position. The leader of the Conservatives has to be able to handle
an eruption of Euroscepticism as surely as the All England Club has to decide whether to close the Wimbledon
centre court roof during a shower. It's no good saying, "Who would have thought it, eh, rain in summer?"
You simply cannot stop the Tories banging on about Europe, and certainly not by promising a referendum at some
point, if a renegotiation of some kind does not deliver something or other.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
Coupled with this all is that the tories close to a 100, dont want a renegotiation, they want out.
and for them nothing else will do.
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
but its down to public debate surely as in a vote.but somthing is nagging me in that they are frightend of a vote the wrong way.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
Brian
I have to say, should there ever be a vote, I think people would vote to come out
The danger is,,, is this realy the best for the country.
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
kieth,i would say its a 50/50 split,and having to go for a second round.at tax payers expence.
as for the last sentace I would say it might damage our rep if we did leave the eu.but I could be classed as biased.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
as things stand brian is probably roughly right, the anti eu voices are louder but is suspect that just as many do not like change especially those who have known the times when we were an independent country.
where things could change is when one or more current member states drop out of the euro as a precursor to leaving the union altogether.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
I think pulling out would win the vote
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Britain isn't an independent country anymore, but is subject to foreign parliaments.
And pays EU tributes to foreign governments.
Parliament won't allow an EU in/out referendum either.
The queen also forbade an EU in/out referendum in her speech to Parliament.
She receives EU subsidies for her farm estates, so there may be a conflict of interest, but as head of "the government" she has the last word.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Kate and Wills have to be shown how a monarch must be harsh with Parliament.
Never mind the People and Democracy, the monarch has to know when to omit a democratic vote from Parliament's programme for governing "the country".
Ahem, not to forget, they are head of half the world he he
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Oh and the amendment expressing regret at the omission of an EU in/out referendum in the queen's speech has been rejected in Parliament with an overwhelming majority.
So there you go, says the queen triumphantly to Kate and Wills, they shall be humiliated!
NO democracy! And make sure you get a bank holiday and strike a 0.5% hole in the GDP, just to show them who you are and that they will pay for it and worship you. Yes YOU!
Pah!
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
alex,some bad news,the other 26 countrys are also indipendant.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,572
its all falling apart,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS