Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
here you are jack.
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Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
Like the band I was in
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Have to disagree I thought it was not that interesting, just the usual stuff about lack of resources, doctors leaving in droves etc. He tells us that the service is on its death bed but doesn't offer any solutions and says that the PM should sort it out urgently. He doesn't say whether it is about funding, modernisation or a bit of both.
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Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
No. He does not offer solutions or quick-fixes. What he does call for is a Royal Commission. I agree.
There are three serious questions. How much the NHS should do, for whom and paid for how. Only once these parameters are agreed can you start designing a proper service, the present mess having grown more by mutation than by any design, which is great in evolutionary terms except we've never allowed the bits that don't work to wither and die.
A Royal Commission is an incredibly wide-ranging and very powerful inquiry, which is why governments tend not to like them. Once started, they can’t be easily shut down. They are independent of government and are so in-depth, hearing from such a wide range of experts and interested parties, that they can run on for several years. And this is precisely what we need: a debate, once and for all, about what the NHS is for.
Brian Dixon, Paul M and howard mcsweeney1 like this
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Guest 1849- Registered: 12 Sep 2016
- Posts: 440
"They are independent of government and are so in-depth, hearing from such a wide range of experts and interested parties, that they can run on for several years."
Several years eh, by which time there'll be even more people living even longer requiring boob jobs and gastric bands. The labour solution is to throw more money at it like a drunk at the casino, the tory solution is to brush it under the carpet.
We need a two tier system where people are encouraged to opt out of NI and take out PHI.
I'm happy for anybody to tell me how this wouldn't work. (It does already but plenty of people already pay for both).
btw before anybody starts virtue signalling, pop into a dentist in town and ask him to do a filling for free. Its time we all woke up.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
D Little wrote:"They are independent of government and are so in-depth, hearing from such a wide range of experts and interested parties, that they can run on for several years.
Unfortunately David this is the only way forward. Any attempt at reform by any party will be politicised by opposition parties. We are at such a state with our new secular religion, worship of an NHS which is half myth, that closing down even the most inefficient, expensive and unnecessary department anywhere in the UK would be met with column inches of press coverage and protest from locals.
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
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'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Guest 1849- Registered: 12 Sep 2016
- Posts: 440
Captain Haddock wrote:Unfortunately David this is the only way forward. Any attempt at reform by any party will be politicised by opposition parties. We are at such a state with our new secular religion, worship of an NHS which is half myth, that closing down even the most inefficient, expensive and unnecessary department anywhere in the UK would be met with column inches of press coverage and protest from locals.
And?
People aren't as squeamish as you think, take away the dyed in the wool lefties most people realise that we have an ageing and growing population.
I thought politics was about taking unpopular but correct decisions not pandering to the lowest common denominator.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
One of the main reasons I support fox hunting is because it annoys people like Brian Dixon.
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
Captain Haddock wrote: we've never allowed the bits that don't work to wither and die.
Isn't that what the Tories are actually doing to people? Cut the DLA and put them on a PIP. Force them onto JSA then sanction them. Send the JAMs into working poverty and get the 'Big Society' charities, like the Trussell Trust to do food parcels. Take school lunches away and give the kids a pop-tart cut that gets cut. In short, [B]
allow the bits that don't work to wither and die.[/B]
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Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
I think that is actually Brian (not Dixon) and not Jesus. Any more of that blasphemy and Cardinal Fang will give you the comfy chair torture.
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Captain Haddock- Location: Marlinspike Hall
- Registered: 8 Oct 2012
- Posts: 7,496
I have just sat through the hustings in Dover.
I have lost the will to live as well as the will to vote.
Keef can do the report. :-(
'If no one went no faster than what I do there'd be a sight less trouble in this world'
Guest 745- Registered: 27 Mar 2012
- Posts: 3,370
one of the biggest things we could do for the NHS is fee it from litigation so the paper shufflers can be sacked
then reinvest the cash save backing into the service and training.
and maybe the private sector should have to pick up the tab for the training of its staff
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Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
Keith Bibby wrote:one of the biggest things we could do for the NHS is fee it from litigation so the paper shufflers can be sacked
then reinvest the cash save backing into the service and training.
and maybe the private sector should have to pick up the tab for the training of its staff
Top two out of three ain't bad, Mr Bibby.
Private Sector is ... well, I wouldn't start from here!
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,577
OK so heres a little brief outline of what came across to me at tonights Dover Hustings.
In a packed hall there were some very interesting questions, but my angle is on the answers.
Lets just start by the geezers themselves;
The Green candidate, without doubt is a passionate supporter of the planet, but if she is honest looked like a fish out of water.
Very passionate in viewpoints but often missing the opportunity to answer the question.
Becky is passionate about Dover and I applaud anyone who at least puts there name forward.
The Lib Dem stand in candidate didn't appear that well briefed, and often wandered off into lib dem land.
The problem was Sarah Smith (who is sadly no longer with us) although I may not agree with her politics she had the passion and even knowledge to push things in a particular direction
Tonight's candidate pushing the referendum second vote, (although not admitting that is what it is about) will do little in Dover. Where most people have moved on accepting Brexit will happen and nowlooking at getting a best deal.
The UKIP stand in candidate, I feel came across fairly well, until he got into his view on the last leader being the leader then leaving then coming back, it made him look a little silly, but other than that he spoke openly and honestly on the questions put, and of the 5 candidates he probably came across the best.
When he wasn't quoting national policy and a local viewpoint he did well.
The Labour candidate I feel did better than I expected, although the opening gambit appeared like a prepared speech from head office.
I think once this stage was passed and the public questions began Stacy came into her own a little on local issues although personal things like where she works tended to drift away from the question, and her references to tories switched people off, and at one point her making comments aloud to someone in the front row doesn't go down well..
Has she the ability/experience as the only real challenger to Charlie? Time will tell, but I don't think so.
The conservative candidate didn't appear that strong considering he is the sitting MP he did answer all the questions, but often on a national basis .
he didn't appear to have any answers on the local shipping industry which affects us, or how to try to solve it.
I understand he was being texted answers from the audience, as texts were seen being sent
that saId if he cant answer for himself.
He came across a little smug, and not really in touch with local opinion.
This could backfire on him.
So all in all the biggest issue facing all the politicians is apathy, this is likely to be one of the lowest turnouts for a general election,
People are not engaged with any political party, and apathy is likely to be the only winners.
I don't share the view that youngsters are not interested in politics. Many have very strong views on wide ranging subjects but cannot find a party they can fit into so don't vote.
that doesn't mean there not interested or don't talk about politics they do its about identity.
I'm sure as the meeting was packed others who attended will add there view.
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ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,658
Thanks Keith.
With regards to you view on Charlie, he always comes across as "a little smug" in my opinion.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,577
Jan,
I'v attempted to be as fair as possible on tonights meeting, even in the knowledge that Charlie has lots of conservatives that wont be voting for him.
but hopefully others may give there own views on tonight
I should also add the Bishop of Dover who chaired the meeting did so in an unbiased manner and kept good control
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ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Excellent report Keith, the thing is we all know the result of this election but the real issue is how we get democracy back on track. Clive Lewis is favourite to take the helm but despite his legitimate claims my antennae says that this is the chap that will bring the country together again.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/19/labours-2015-election-result-is-no-yardstick-for-success-says-starmer