Exactly. It is a case of thinking it through.........!
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
# 136.....agree no surprises...but thanks Ross for putting up the article......there are ofcourse more names
and if any of them are publicaly against the Reform they are ofcourse hypocrites but all of them join the
`elite` greedy pigs list.
Comments from posters supporting the Reform Bill would be interesting...................
Tomorrow Cameron hosts summit on the Reform Bill,the list of invites are as # 123. states and leaves out
some very important professionals indicating Cameron`s bias...........error of judgement...........
``You do not improve the NHS by closing No 10`s door to GP`s ,nurses and patients groups ``
This weeks poll...................Cameron not trusted with the NHS.....................
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i have still not seen or read any debate on the bill, just people using sound bites.
if you question the proposed reforms you get rebuffed as a luddite.
there must be some nasty stuff hidden away if there needs to be such secrecy.
I think questioning the proposals as they are set out is good, gets people thinking - it's people who resist any reforms at all who appear unrealistic. Questioning is positive, blocking is unhelpful especially as most of those trying to block the reforms have nothing to suggest to put in their place and often appear to think everything is rosy as it is!!
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
The reform proposals are particularly lengthy and complex. I would love to see just one post on this thread from someone who knows the NHS inside out; knows the reform proposals inside out; has no particular axe to grind; and can describe the proposed changes in jargon-free language, giving reasons why they support or oppose them.
It won't happen of course.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Good luck with that.
I will try to answer some of the above. Devolve services down to community level Gps decide what to commision as they are the perma link between primary and secondary care
Get rid of the massive beaurocracy that is the PCTs
Increase the power of Monitor to regulate foundation hospitals
Build in more effective checks with real penalties to underperforming organizations
Use local forums to drive Health Changes
Use local bodies to try and reduce the divide between health and social care
The rub is until this bill is in place no one is sure if the total effect of the legislation
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
"Build in more effective checks with real penalties to underperforming organizations" is the key factor which should operate at all levels. But organisations underperform primarily because managers underperform. Stretching targets need to be set for all managers and their jobs should depend on achieving them.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
No arguments from here.........
Paul Watkins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 9 Nov 2011
- Posts: 2,226
Sarah is virtually there with her analysis.
The legislative requirements are to abolish the organisations that currently undertake the functions of above & move the responsibilities.
For those that talk about privatisation that provision already exists at present for service supply put in by the last government.
Watty
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Cameron`s Summit today is following in the disastrous foot steps of the PCT method of consultation..........
................consult......disregard........carry on regardless...........so much for his promise to remove ...Top
down control.
Cameron has taken over from Lansley to drive through the Reform Bill without amendments.
He admits changes ( without legislation !!!! ) are too advanced to be halted....even if it ends up passing a
deeply flawed piece of legislation.
He has not invited any of the majority of the professional organisations....so much for his promise to listen to
the people....he has the habit of surrounding himself with yes people...dangerous error of judgement.
Cameron`s effort to succeed against all odds without the attendence of nurses,doctors,phisyios GP`s who
keep the health service going is extraordinary arrogance and continues his error of judgement tendencies.
If he succeeds with this course of action the public will have its say in 2015.
The momentum of the ``Cameron cannot be trusted with the NHS``is growing fast daily ...it is 70% against
him now.
And the alternative.........?
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
For your consideration............
This Wednesday, there's a crunch NHS vote in Parliament. MPs will vote on whether to demand the publication of a secret government report into the risks facing the NHS. That could be another nail in the coffin of Andrew Lansley's plans - so let's pile the pressure on our MPs to vote the right way.
Right now, Andrew Lansley is in a tricky position to defend. He wants MPs and Lords to back his plans for the NHS. But he's refusing to let them find out what the risks are. If we work together to put our MPs under pressure, there's a decent chance they'll refuse to do Lansley's dirty work for him.
This vote could go either way - send your MP an email asking them to back publishing the secret report - it takes two minutes:
https://secure.38degrees.org.uk/nhs-risk-report
The vote will take place on Wednesday afternoon. That means we've got just over 48 hours to convince enough MPs to vote to publish the secret report. The more of us that email our MPs right now, the more likely we are to succeed.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Exactly Bern.
We see plenty of whinging from those with a political or vested interest angle but precious few alternatives being proposed.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
an alternative would be get rid of the dead wood for a start, bring people in from private industry with a track record in procurement thereby saving a fortune and having a few qualified managers in at evenings and weekends to find out who the malingerers are.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Easily said Howard, rather than done. Define deadwood and identify what deadwood would need to be identifying the other deadwood that needs to be done away with!!!!!!
Of course if we went and did a wholescale privatisation of the NHS all the deadwood would be cut out very quickly.
#155 is a good plan! And for the reforms to work will be an important part of the practical details.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
barry
i have spent one night in hospital in my entire life, what an experience that was.
i could have wrote a book on the 10 hours i spent there, once the excellent paramedics dropped me off i was left with the dross of the health service,
a doctor,nurses, porters, radiologists - you name them and not one of them could hsve held down an outside job.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
That is sad Howard but you still get to the problem I identified in translating that to practise. Hopefully Bern is right and the reforms might help resolve that but one thing is for sure privately run hospital could not afford the dross to which you refer..... I trust then that you will be supporting the Lansley/Cameron plan even if you cannot support the more radical ideas that I would support.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
not sure what they actually entail barry so cannot offer unthinking support.
i have had to visit people at weekends and the same problem exists, bored staff reading dire magazines, cleaners banging and crashing around sick people the list is endless.
the normal daytime staff are usually of the highest order, if managers took turns in covering weekends and evenings they would see for themselves what goes on.
the three warnings needed would not take long to get rid of many.