Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
I,m extremely annoyed that the wreaths have been removed from the Memorial after only 9 days & it seems although I have only heard rumours that those that laid them were not told of the removal. I know some people wanted to lay the wreaths on graves. I,m aware that the weather has been awful but that,s no excuse for this & I feel it's extremely disrespectful. A lot of people are angry.
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Guest 1881- Registered: 16 Oct 2016
- Posts: 1,071
Both post #1 and #2 are valid. I think post #1 makes a bona-fide point, albeit it with half the information. We ought to expect our council to be serving us in this duty. Post #2 is spot on, knowing the facts behind the removal. Let's be kind to one another. Both of you have made well-meaning points and have your hearts in the right place.
Blessings to both!
howard mcsweeney1 likes this
Just because you don't take an interest in politics doesn't mean that politics won't take an interest in you. PERICLES.
Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
My point was why so early, I,m not criticising the people who do the work, so you,re telling me it could not be done a little later in the future ? I,m sorry I find that hard to believe. Some of those that laid the wreaths wanted them to put on relatives graves can you imagine how they feel ? If my post offends & they refuse to do it next year then yes I,ll do it No question I have a very good reason for doing it. I wanted the people from Dover to be remembered for longer than 9 days if this upsets you then please don't read my post, I will not be removing it.
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Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
I also volunteer to remove all wreaths & crosses next year at an appropriate time suiting everyone.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Good to see his grace raise the level of debate to the spiritual. My advice would be to avoid the serpent as described in Genesis. Not wanting to libel anyone but the modern translation comes up as Lyn mac - ring any bells?
Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
Doesn't ring any bells with me, but then again Howard Mcsweeney you would know all about serpents
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Guest 1292- Registered: 23 Jun 2014
- Posts: 23
It is nice, though, that there are those whom are able to get annoyed and indulge in their annual "virtue signalling". Well done!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
Excellent post MMM the faux angry brigade are there at every wreath laying for their own reasons.
Guest 1767- Registered: 1 Jun 2016
- Posts: 49
Find it very strange Viv Matcham that the volunteers you mention who work 7 days a week , are available immediately on the beckoning of the Town Clerk! the only volunteer I know about is the person who retrieved and made good all the wreaths after being tossed about by Storm Angus, as far as I know, All the wreaths & crosses were made good and replaced by the following morning, unless there has been another storm that I must of slept through, there was NO reason at all to remove them so soon. As you say they were put somewhere safe? I don't call the Tip a respectable safe place. The people who laid the wreaths should have been given notice to collect them and use as they so wish, not just be thrown in a black bag. Shame on the Town Clerk for letting this occur.
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Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
My reasons are respect & Rememberence for my family who were all killed June 12th 1941 the only survivor being my Father who was abroad fighting so please do not go any further with your insults Howard Mcsweeney. Do not refer to me as the angry brigade.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
How many times have you said that you will not post here dear Lyn?
Guest 1862- Registered: 23 Sep 2016
- Posts: 163
May I please shed some light on the subject? Whilst out for my daily walk I noticed the bin liners full of wreaths stood by the memorial. Thinking this rather odd behaviour must have a valid reason I tried to find out why this was the case. I therefor contacted those who might furnish me with a reliable explanation; - Chair of County Branch and a representative of the Town council. My understanding of the situation is that a number of people are indeed upset at the early removal of the many wreaths, bad weather having been given as the cause. One then wonders why were the wreaths removed after the same time span last year, ( as stated by RBL members). RBL had been summoned to the DTC office to establish when the crosses would be removed. Removal of wreaths became part of that discussion. The gentleman, I was furnished with his name but it would be improper to disclose it, then took it upon himself to remove wreaths there and then, without prior notification to the chair or groups/individuals who had placed wreaths. The bin liners were left in situ for some time and them removed and transported to the local refuse tip where they were disposed off by being "mulched". By all accounts a sincere apology will be placed in both local papers by RBL for the course 1 member decided to take. My personal view is that the removal is untimely and wreaths are secured by tent pegs in the town in Devon where I used to live, thus securing them safely in an unobtrusive manner. One also frequently hears it's protocol to post a notice, informing all participants of the Remembrance service about the date wreaths will be removed, so as to permit those who so wish to collect their wreaths. One family I know have re used a "family wreath" several times. It looks pristine. Hope this helps. I prefer to gain my information from the closest possible source, thus hopefully avoiding contamination by unfounded or inaccurate suppositions.
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Guest 1338- Registered: 9 Sep 2014
- Posts: 79
Thankyou Anna for your post it does clear the air, sadly it is difficult to post on this forum without certain people resulting to ridicule. Earlier this year I was in Blackpool the Memorial is right on the seafront & wreaths were still present from last November, it was neat & tidy a credit to whoever looks after it. Ours was covered in leaves but at least one person went every day to replace crosses & tidy the wreaths he isn't RBL or DTC just an ordinary person showing respect.
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Guest 1862- Registered: 23 Sep 2016
- Posts: 163
It is indeed "the ordinary" who often perform in an extraordinary way. Usually they seek no recognition but act out of a sense of moral duty or respect. Very appropriate for this situation.
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Guest 1862- Registered: 23 Sep 2016
- Posts: 163
Vic Matcham, It is quite obvious you misread my post. The information that the bin bags with wreaths were taken to the tip came from the local RBL branch secretary. The branch has been active for 2 years if her information is correct and one supposes she has a reasonable idea. In fact the exceedingly nice lady together with her husband drove to the refuse tip themselves to try and reclaim the wreaths but were told they had been destroyed. Generally speaking RBL members are not quite as easily upset as you claim you would be. In practice, most of the country relies on volunteers for many jobs. There are First responders who are first aiders who give their time and expertise, charities, soup kitchens, appropriate adults, neighbours who look after each other etc. So as much as we admire the dedicated work of the RBL members, they see it, usually, as a privilege to help and serve and certainly don't look for recognition for everything they do. The removal of the crosses had been discussed before the storm had caused it's disruption, again, information gained from the same person.
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Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
I have removed all my post about this, I have found it upsetting. end
Guest 1862- Registered: 23 Sep 2016
- Posts: 163
No doubt when the local papers are released next Thursday, we shall have an answer in black and white. if my information was right, I shall make a point of contacting those who provided it to thank them. If it was wrong, I shall most certainly contact them again and expect a further explanation. Hope that eases your upset state Vic Matcham. Either way, once a statement has been posted in the public media it is only right to either confirm or disprove it, if it has been challenged.
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Guest 1391- Registered: 1 Nov 2014
- Posts: 199
I too made enquiries following original post, and yes were removed by RBL, but not all I understand. Can only think because of the awful windy weather.
Guest 1862- Registered: 23 Sep 2016
- Posts: 163
The only thing remaining were the bunches of cut flowers. Removed all wreaths after consultation with the town clerk. Removal of the crosses had been agreed prior to any mention of bad weather. By all accounts, some appear keen to blame the weather, unfortunately that could not be given as the reason for removal of the wreaths last year, after 9 days also, if my research is correct. My findings were confirmed by members of RBL.
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Guest 1735- Registered: 26 Apr 2016
- Posts: 90
Our wreaths & flags stay all year round ,The Cenotaph in Fiennes where my Grandparents live is adorned by ALL flags and wreaths are there all yr round regardless of weather ,My Aunt lives in Saint Aubin sur Mer which is a town on the Normandy coast that was in the thick of the Normandy landings ,again the memorial is adorned with flags & leaves all yr round ,Many Cities and Towns here too have there flags & wreaths ,I find it very disrespectful that Dover who was bombarded constantly during WW2 do not give the Forces or the civillians that were killed hardly any respect at all ,Its nice that some Doverians do give up their time to honor them ,I had the privilage to stand on Fri to a small service at St Marys to honour those Dover heroes that fell had fallen during the Somme ..I find your comments strange coming from someone who says they have served in the Military Mr Matcham i would have thought you of all people would be for remembering the fallen not to mention that you were an elected Cllr but then most of Cllrs in DDC & DTC do not care as long as they are in the photos at the end of the day or getting lauded by a vicar who preached how wonderful the Mayor of Dover was 3 yrs ago on Remembrance Sunday ,And has for you Mr Macsweeney you are 1 very intolerant man and apologies should be made to Lyn Mac personal abuse & bullying should never be tolerated at all maybe thats why you have been kicked off every Dover FB page
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