howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#1
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#2
It does indeed Howard - well done Deal.
Roger
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#3
Yep
Now why is Dover in the same district lagging behind?
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#4
I do not really think Deal is any better for actual shopping than Dover
Maybe if we had a more of a cafe culture where the shops are that would help also compress the shopping area so it does not stretch from Market Square all the way up London Road, also the lack of traffic in their Town Hall area partly with its narrow road.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#5
I dont share that view Jan
I think Deal town centre to be far better
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#6
Why?
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 745- Registered: 27 Mar 2012
- Posts: 3,370
#7
If you blink you'd miss it
Ps
I see parachute girl spent no time jumping on the horse
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#8
I do feel that Deal has better shopping, appears to be more welcoming
is easy to get into
not stretched over a wide area
but i share your view jan that if we want to continue with a town centre
then from london road upwards in Dover will struggle
and probably not survive
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#9
i find deal town centre absolutely delightful and am not surprised that it has been recognised in this way.
still mainly independent shops and places to eat and drink, no wonder the steam train takes its passengers there, most of the shops are just a stones throw from the seafront too.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#10
aaahh not just me then
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Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#11
To answer Keith's no3:
-because DTC is not pro-business. They could easily afford a town centre manager out of their precept instead of much of the frippery they splash out on. The Town Team are making a valiant effort but it's slow going without funding.
-because Dover does not have the affluent spenders which attract quality shops.
-because the morons on DDC's planning committee at the time approved a huge Tesco at Whitfield rather than McArthur Glen, killing the town centre, instead of bringing in an asset to attract people to Dover.
-because parking is cheaper and easier in Deal (although Dover isn't bad, and Deal can be a pain in fine weather).
-Dover was much busier and had a good town centre in the days of duty-free. You can thank the EU for the disappearance of that trade.
I think the Tesco decision was the clincher. The council are trying their best to attract quality, but the damage done by previous administrations is just too severe to undo in our lifetime without investment of mega-£, which aren't available.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#12
It appears peter we disagree
DTC is as pro active as any of the other local councils
town centre manager our roger twice has shown thats not the way
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Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#13
all so deal was a miners town,along with lots of seafarers living there to.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#14
There's no silver bullet Keith.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#15
young peter does make some good points.
a) the precept this year was not far short of a million smackers so some could have been spent on a part time town centre manager or dare i say it a market manager?
b) the demographics would not attract the likes of waitrose or debenhams despite what people say.
c) i can't comment on what happened before i moved here but many people have spoken of the days when tins of quality street and the like were left on the pallet in shops because customers from france and belgium were grabbing them so fast there was no point in putting them on shelves, i understand that the same applied to legs of lamb.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#16
and tins of nescafe coffee
Paul Watkins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 9 Nov 2011
- Posts: 2,226
#17
Peter in general I agree with your analysis.
Just a point on the car parking. I believe you'll find Deal's town centre prices are the same as Dover. A couple of car parks offer cheaper rates as do some in Dover.
Another reason may well be Deal's Chamber of Trade is retailed orientated and active.
Judith Roberts- Registered: 15 May 2012
- Posts: 637
#18
I agree with Jan. in terms of actual shopping there isn't much to choose between Deal and Dover High Streets. I love a nice wander in Deal along the seafront and back down through the shopping area, stopping for a nice lunch at 81 Beach St or wherever, but a lot of those upmarket little shops are only open a few hours a week. Deal does have a big advantage in being nicely compact with a traditional High Street and the supermarkets very close to that High Street. In Dover I tend to go either to the Morrisons end of town or to the M&S area. I would rarely go to both areas on one trip to town.
Guest 697- Registered: 13 Apr 2010
- Posts: 622
#19
Deal certainly is at an advantage with its more compact high street and close proximity to the seafront. Remember, Dover town sits in a valley so its development has been linear and there is no clear centre to the town. That's one of the reasons why the St James's development is so important - it will give Dover a "centre" - and be a shop window for traffic heading to and from the Eastern Docks. The biggest problem Dover has, in my opinion, is negativity. Cineworld and M&S have clearly seen the potential, so let's all have a more positive outlook in 2014.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#20
Couldn't agree more with Peter G's comments, also Paul W's and Kevin Charles' and completely disagree with Keith S's comment about I showed that a Business Support Manager is not the way. I believe it is absdolutely the way forward.
Howard's paragraph 1 is also so true. I have said several times about the Town Team creating a proper business plan, but they have steadfastly refused to do so.
I have also said about a Market Manager being taken on and paid (on a commission basis) out of the money from the stall-holders, so there's no initial cost, who would be requested (and paid) to go out and about to other Towns and Farmers' Markets, to bring new stalls here so creating a market, not only to be proud of, but one that will attract people from outside of Dover too.
There's no reason why we couldn't have between 30 and 40 stalls here.
As Paul W said in post 17, Deal Chamber of Trade is run like a Town Centre Management body and is retail orientated and pro-active.
Roger
