howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i think that post 20 seems to be nearest the truth, i have heard some incredible excuses for the behaviour from people keen to get on the telly in the last day or so.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I agree very much with Andrew on this one.
I know we are not supposed to generalise, but most of these youngsters are probably unemployed and have very low academic achievement, some may be drug dealers/users too.
A lot of good quality of life emanates from a good education, it is the key to freedom in so many ways. I would guess that many of these people skived off school and have no education or qualifications and have no hope or intention of getting a job.
These riots have escalated because they see it as excitement and the vast majority are getting away with it; even though there are many arrests, there's more that have enjoyed a good night's looting.
I hope they catch them all and punish them severely.
There should be no inncocent bystanders, everyone knows what's going on.
Roger
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
roger,a low academic abilaty i dont think so,seeing that 6 undergraduits,a solisater and 3 others who have signed up to join the armed forces can hardly be called under achivers can they.
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
Opportunists,thieves,low lifes educated or not who under the cover of a riot use it for what can only be described as mass theft of someone else's property. Looting seems somehow too timid a word to use under these circumstances.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
Looting (Hindi lūṭ, akin to Sanskrit luṭhati, [he] steals; also Latin latro, latronis "thief")—also referred to as sacking, plundering, despoiling, despoliation, and pillaging—is the indiscriminate taking of goods by force as part of a military or political victory, or during a catastrophe, such as during war,
[1] natural disaster,
[2] or rioting.
[3] The term is also used in a broader sense, to describe egregious instances of theft and embezzlement, such as the "plundering" of private or public assets by corrupt or greedy authorities.
[4] Looting is loosely distinguished from scavenging by the objects taken; scavenging implies taking of essential items such as food, water, shelter, or other material needed for survival while looting implies items of luxury or not necessary for survival such as art work, precious metals or other valuables. The proceeds of all these activities can be described as loot, plunder, or pillage.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
Marek#24
I suspect that a lot of the looters would not want employment even if there were plenty of jobs they could go into.
Education and academic prowess has nothing to do with this awful situation because they are clever enough to get themselves organised into these large groups to steal and possibly sell on the stolen goods.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
Jan
You are right there are jobs for those that want them. My son left Stafford College to find work in Jersey. He started chef-ing (his career) but when laid off at the end of the summer found work immediately with Jersey Electric doing something with computers (clueless Dad) doubled his salary but it meant a change of direction not only in his vocation but career.
No excuse they should get off their lazy arses and do ANYTHING to feed themselves and their family. Personally I would put the yobs back on the streets cleaning up the bloody mess they've made...and that goes for the onlookers as well if it was fun to watch they can pay for their fun by shifting the glass and rubble.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
You can still be an under achiever and know how to operate a mobile/smart phone.
Brian, are you saying that "6 undergraduates,a solicitor and 3 others who have signed up to join the armed forces" were involved in the rioting and looting ? If that is the case, no I would not say they are underachievers.
Roger
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
Watching the TV pictures this morning the really striking thing was that the looters were predominantly young and black.
Those who rallied together with their brooms to clear up were predominantly young and white. Well done to them they are showing the true British culture that so many seem to seek but not join.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 683- Registered: 11 Feb 2009
- Posts: 1,052
Jan
this may be a consequence of young, black males being significantly more likely to underachieve at school, to be excluded from school and to be unemployed after school.
When you feel detached from society and worthless you have very little to lose and many of these young people do feel that.
Some interesting talk on the radio this morning of gang culture providing stability and role models (albeit totally inappropriate and undesirable) for many inner city youngsters. The answers will be complex and need careful thinking through but I suspect we will get a knee-jerk response from politicians who want to be seen to be 'potent'.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
And we shall see mealy-mouthed politicians of all parties, tiptoeing around what many of the public see as the main issue, for fear of being labelled racist or fascist.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Jan, the footage I was watching last night showed a majority of white males doing the rioting. There would also appear to be groups using the riots for their own prejudices. In London, and apart from the areas of violent rioting, a group attacked and wrecked the "Gay's the Word" bookshop in Bloomsbury while another group attacked the East London Mosque in East Ham.
There does not seem to be a racial make up to the main areas of rioting, although there is a clear uniform of black jeans, black hoodie and black peaked cap. Any racial element is more likely to come from such groups as the English Defence League, who were out in force in some areas last night claiming to be prepared to 'defend the streets'.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
Mark, is it part of the black male culture to underachieve or is it that they are just bloody lazy and wish they were back in Jamaica lazing in the sun having everything handed to them.
I know that seems hard and possibly racist but the Asians are achievers and hard working and I did not notice many of them looting.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Sorry Jan but that is rubbish. I know lazy Asians, hard working blacks and, while working at the Job Club, have met far too many unemployed young white males who cannot understand why there is any point in getting up before midday to look for work.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
I don't think this is a racial matter at all. It is pure criminality that's all, it transcends race.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Apparently Dan Snow rugby tackled a looter and made a citizens arrest !
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 656- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,262
Yes Paul, I saw that on BBC1 this morning. Dan Snow and Sian Williams were talking about tonights National Treasures programme from Dover Castle.
Now how can I get rugby tackled by Dan
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
Well done Dan.
Chris, I also know there is laziness in all races, in Dover they would be mainly white because we are predominantly white in this area. I admit I was generalising, which was naughty, I was responding to Mark's comment because I am fed up being told that black youths are underachievers, the black girls seem to do OK at school.
I saw that very brave lady telling the looters off on tv this morning, a wonderful sensible woman. What a shame so many parents were not talking to their children like that.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
girls in general do better than boys at school last time i heard.
at one time most teachers were male so the boys related to the teaching better, now the situation is reversed, i don't know if this applies locally.