howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#961
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#962
Jezza holding a meeting of the rest of the Parliamentary Labour party.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#963
For me the big problem with Jezza is that he surrounds himself with people who hold exactly the same views as him and anyone more centrist is side lined. Blair had John Prescott as his deputy and various left wingers like Corbyn were not hounded out even though they consistently voted against the government.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#964
Courtesy of the Times.
Labour has pledged to hold a “massive listening exercise” after seven MPs resigned from the party.
John McDonnell, the shadow chancellor, said his party had to address some of the criticisms levelled at it after Tom Watson, the party’s deputy leader, warned of a further exodus unless there were reforms. Other shadow cabinet members responded by saying they were disappointed that the seven MPs had left and called for unity around the Labour manifesto that voters backed in large numbers at the last general election.
But Mr McDonnell, who on Monday urged the seven who quit to resign from parliament and trigger by-elections in their seats, went further saying that he had listened carefully to what Mr Watson had said at an angry and emotional meeting of the parliamentary Labour Party (PLP) last night. He told Sky news: “I listened to what Tom Watson said and and I agree with him. We need to start listening and that is what we will do.” He want on: “We need a mammoth, massive listening exercise and [to] address some of those criticisms that have been made.” “I think we are finding the way forward but has to be on basis of taking the advice of Tom Watson and the PLP and others.”
He also played down suggestions that more than 30 Labour MPs had considered joining the new breakaway group, saying he did not think the potential defections were “on that scale”. But the “Labour leadership — and I’m part of that — we need to keep listening, bring people in, talk to them,” he said. “If there are issues we need to address we will address them. If it is about the style of the leadership we will address that. If it is about policy we listen to that as well.” Mr McDonnell said the “only disagreement we have had within the party is around how we handle Brexit and I think we are bringing people together on that”.
Reginald Barrington
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 17 Dec 2014
- Posts: 3,261
#965
Mr McDonnell said the “only disagreement we have had within the party is around how we handle Brexit and I think we are bringing people together on that”.
Really? The only disagreement, where's he been since Corbyn took over the leadership?
Paul M and Jan Higgins like this
Arte et Marte
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#966
Reginald Barrington wrote:Mr McDonnell said the “only disagreement we have had within the party is around how we handle Brexit and I think we are bringing people together on that”.
Really? The only disagreement, where's he been since Corbyn took over the leadership?
The saying 'None so blind as those that will not see' springs to mind.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#967
Growing disenchantment amongst Jezza's supporters who are frustrated with his leadership.
https://news.sky.com/story/labours-brexit-bind-will-only-get-tighter-11647547howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#968
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#969
I think it's an own goal
Country wide
I hope his tactics work
But I suspect they wont
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#970
Labour constantly tell us that they are for the many not the few, Jezza goes a step further and embraces the concept of for the Mussie and the Jew.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#971
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#972
Labour seem to be tying themselves up in knots unable to distinguish between anti-Semitism and anti-Zionism.
Courtesy of the Times.
Labour has suspended one of its most senior candidates in May’s local elections after he claimed that “Nazism and Zionism are equally foul”. The Labour councillor, a fireman and former soldier, also reposted content suggesting that Israel should be “relocated into the United States” — the same comments that led to the suspension of the Labour MP Naz Shah in 2016. Sean McCallum, who was selected last week as the party’s candidate to be the elected mayor of Mansfield, posted the remark about Nazism on his personal Facebook page after Ken Livingstone’s suspension in 2016. “All makes perfect sense. I can’t see anything vaguely antisemitic here,” he posted.
Five mayoral contests are to be held at the May elections, making Mr McCallum one of Labour’s most senior candidates. He was suspended within hours of the party being made aware of the posts by The Times. In a statement it said: “The Labour Party takes all complaints of antisemitism extremely seriously and we are committed to challenging and campaigning against it in all its forms. All complaints about antisemitism are fully investigated in line with our rules and procedures and any appropriate disciplinary action is taken.”
Lord Falconer of Thoroton has said he will turn down a request by Labour to investigate its handling of antisemitism if the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) goes ahead with an official inquiry. The former lord chancellor told the Jewish News: “In light of the commission coming in, I think we’ve got to put it on hold, see what the commission is going to do. If they are minded to do an investigation, they will have a range of statutory powers to get documents, emails, WhatsApp messages and witnesses, and they will do an investigation that will be completely independent from the Labour Party.”
Peers have told Jeremy Corbyn that their party is in “crisis” over his “political failure” to fight antisemitism. In a letter to the party leader on behalf of the 185-strong Labour group on the red benches, Lord Harris of Haringey, its chairman, told Mr Corbyn the peers wanted “to put on record our alarm at what is frankly an embarrassing and hugely damaging mess caused by the ongoing failure to remove antisemites from our party”.
Reginald Barrington- Location: Dover
- Registered: 17 Dec 2014
- Posts: 3,261
#973
Corbyn the gift that keeps on giving!
Arte et Marte
Weird Granny Slater
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,095
#974
Not really. I think Labour adopted the IDA (
https://antisemitism.uk/definition/ ) and it's clear that the use of the term 'Zionist' (and its diminutive 'Zio') outside purely academic discussions of 'Zionism' is now regarded as being antisemitic. See, for example, the HoC Home Affairs Committee report on antisemitism in the UK 2016-17 (
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617/cmselect/cmhaff/136/136.pdf ): 'For the purposes of criminal or disciplinary investigations, use of the words 'Zionist' or 'Zio' in an accusatory or abusive context should be considered inflamatory and potentially antisemitic'.
'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#975
"Potentially anti-Semitic" is a very vague term but leaving that aside there are many Jews around the world including Israel that abhor the actions of the Israeli Government and are wholly against Zionism. So would a Jewish Labour member who thought that be kicked out of the party for being anti-Semitic?
Weird Granny Slater- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 3,095
#976
I'm assuming that 'potentially antisemitic' here means 'worthy of further investigation'. Criticism of Israel's government isn't necessarily antisemitic under the IDA, but depends on the nature of the criticism. There are certainly many British Jews who are critical of Israel's government, and as around 41% of British Jews don't consider themselves to be 'Zionist' I guess the short answer to your question, HM, is 'Yes. Potentially'. Useful survey of attitudes here:
http://www.city.ac.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/295361/Israel-Report-FINAL.PDF'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#977
any excuse to call people rasist or anti jewish.
but if its ok to call an arab an arab, or a welsh man or a scot a scot or irish an irish man. but all so if you call yourself English youre a rasist thug.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#978
Courtesy of the Telegraph.
The scale of Labour's deepening split has been laid bare after 160 MPs and peers including grandees and shadow ministers attended the launch of a new moderate "party within a party" led by Tom Watson. Grandees who supported Tony Blair and Gordon Brown and waged war during the New Labour years set aside their differences as they attended the meeting organised by Mr Watson, the party's deputy leader. Leading Blairites including Lord Mandelson, Lord Blunkett and Pat McFadden attended alongside Brownites such as Mr Watson, Yvette Cooper and Lord Wood.
Lord Mandelson said that it was time for "Blairites and Brownites to work together to save the party". Lord Kinnock, the former Labour leader, and John Prescott, the former Deputy Prime Minister, also attended. Lord Kinnock made an impassioned plea for previously warring factions to “come together” as he drew upon his own experience of fighting the hard-left. A dozen shadow ministers were present along with grandees including Andy McDonald, the shaow Transport Secretary, Gloria De Piero, Jim McMahon and Justine Madders. Mr Watson denied that he was forming another "faction" and insisted that the grouping was intended to stop further resignations from the party. However a former Cabinet minister who attended the meeting told Huffington Post: "This is the only chance left for the party, it has been seized and asset stripped by the left."
The group will work on its own policies and is even said to be considering it's own whipping arrangements. Mr Watson, the Deputy Labour leader, said: "The last few weeks have been very difficult and upsetting. "I really fear that unless we restore pluralism and tolerance to this party it will be irreparably damaged and we will see a schism bigger than any we have experienced in our long history.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#979
A "party within a party" will only work if those that have the power can persuade party members to agree and join.
Many of today's young members or voters will have no idea who the past powerful names mentioned in that article are and if they do these 'oldies' and their opinions will probably be ignored.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#980
May well be true Jan but how many of those young enthusiasts have now lost interest in politics now that they realise Jezza doesn't want us to stay in the EU? In addition to the many traditional Labour voters who will return once the party appears mainstream again there are people that have voted Tory that would switch due to the current state of public services.
