Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
I am not big on this particular 'F' word. It could be argued that it has never had much worth as a word, "Life just isn't..." It could certainly be argued that is has been cheapened even from it's initial status by the cuddle-craving, vote-hungry and regard-reaping politician:the more the word is used the less it's presence is felt.
It is hardly necessary to draw upon the capricious nature of survival in the stone-age in order to illuminate the pros and cons of chance. We are where we are. And we are in a society governed by laws and regulations, the bulk of which have grown with us over millennia, and Governed in this and other ways through a man-made, tried and tested process called Democracy. (Or at least as Gandhi said, we should give Democracy a go.)
[And in any case, the wealthiest man in the world is not he who invented sliced-bread, even though that is often held as the Acme of achievement.]
All we have in life is: Self, others and Society. And no other system known to mankind can hold these three in balance better than an open and free Democratic System.
There is, however, another word much misunderstood and much misused that I do have time for: 'Worth' and it's siblings; worthy and worthiness. (and an even more significant term that has snuck in. Balance)
Whether 'F' or no, it is plainly a sign of a lack of Balance when any who have wealth regard the getting of such wealth as being all their own hard work. It is never so, or only true in the strictest sense of he who prints his own. And what can such be worth?
Man does not live by bread alone, maaan!
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Lets try to keep it simple...If we ask people..``Is that Fair?``..you will invariably receive the same answer.
Not all wealthy people are `elite greedy pigs`......`elite greedy pigs `stand out like a sore thumb.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
I see Reg - in other words people you decide arbitrarily to dislike. The fact is you do not really know them at all and know nothing about how they spend their money, whether they are greedy or not.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,888
............"Not all wealthy people are `elite greedy pigs`......`elite greedy pigs `stand out like a sore thumb."
So unless you know the person personally such a description is meaningless possibly born out of jealousy or spite as Bern has said.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
In any time-honoured, self-regulated eco-system;the rain forest, for instance. Life goes on at many levels. There are those that scramble about the leaf-litter, those that walk along the ground, some who swing from bough to bough and others who soar from tree-top to tree-top. And all is well. All is well for each above contributes something to those below, their half consumed high-level fruit or even their excrement only, for this may contain seeds as sustenance for those below or for the regeneration of fruiting trees.
BUT!
If into this well ordered array of sustainable life there comes some that take, and take in great measure, but do not share even a part of this with the system below, then all that which sustains life is thrown into disarray. None below, at any level, may know these 'parasites' [Oops, 'parasites' is the wrong word. For parasites must sustain their hosts. Vampires, then.] none below may even be aware of the detrimental effect of their comings and goings and view them as 'exotic' and wondrous beasts. Yet, objectively, their actions can be plainly seen as ruinous to the sustainability of all life in the rain-forest eco-system.
Can such 'vampires' not be known, not be known for what they are and what they do, and do not do? As "elite, greedy pigs"?
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
#962. That response to the question "is it fair?" will always be a subjective answer given in the middle of multiple contexts and different fro different people for that reason. Fairness is subjective and nebulous and impossible to measure, and if you can't measure it you cannot assess it or improve it. Equality of opportunity is much easier to manage and judge.
And Tom - I hear what you are saying, but this thread has, from the outset, condemned anyone with what Reg defines as wealth. There will always be those who abuse power or wealth for their own gain. There are many others who despite obtaining wealth will not do so. And indeed, we are not an island and wealth gathers from many quarters with many impacting factors - but those who because of their drive and talent generate wealth not only for themselves but for others as well are tainted with the same insulting and offensive title: Elite Greedy pig.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Jan,thankyou.
Have resisted replying to similar wording from the `few` as it did not matter,but when someone like you,who I regard as a
`fair`minded person,uses the same words it does matter and its time to put it to bed.
There is no need to know the `elite greedy pigs`personally,although I know a few and have worked with many.All the details
of the elite greedy pigs are in the public domain and are simply recorded on the elite greedy pigs thread.
Several times some of us have been accused by the `few`of envy etc.
Personaly we are fortunate to be rather well off and have all we require and more or desire,live in a splended six bedroom
home in four acres of lovely grounds,swimming pool.tennis court in a country village.
Have travelled the world and have no need for a yacht or other homes.Therefore there is no need to envy anyone.
We just want a `fair crack` at life for all.We know thats impossible but we can all try to smooth out the wrinkles between the
rich and poor while we are here.
I don't care much about how or where you live. And share that aim you claim, around fairness of approach. Whatever that means. I simply don't see how we can achieve it by perpetuating the gulf in between the rich and poor or conforming to stereotypes.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
The truth is Reg without knowing the individuals concerned, without knowing about their personal values, without knowing how they spend their own money, you can have no idea whether someone is what you so insultingly brand an 'elite greedy pig'. The only thing you can know is superficial stuff.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
Without knowing...people can be accused of having Sky TV on their own big screen. That seems to be AOK.
Poor pot, poor kettle.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
excellently summed up tom.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,888
#967 shows just what an explosive phrase 'elite greedy pigs' can be. I am sure that there are those who could be using the same expression about Reg with his large house and garden.
Yes I admit I am envious.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
I have an old friend and ex-colleague who was once pilloried in the press as an 'elite greedy pig' because he earned several million a year as CEO and chairman of one of our largest corporations. However he gave away the vast majority of his wealth to charity and now lives in a style similar to that which Reg describes. He is also an ordained priest in the Church of England. He is now a government minister in the House of Lords and waives his salary. He is one of the people tipped to be the next governor of the Bank of England. All his charitable activities are performed anonymously and he is extremely shy of publicity. I suspect that many other 'elite greedy pigs' behave in the same way. I know of two in the Dover district who do.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Well said.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Sir Mervyn King demands the Government speed up the reform of Britains Financial Sector and attacked Bankers for
resisting the reforms in order to protect their large ( obscene ) bonuses.
Sir Merv said the vested interests in the City were trying to scupper the reforms to protect their bonuses and `profit`
structure.
Osbornes dead line of 2019 is seen as a time delay to enable the reform regulations to be watered down.......
.......are we surprised.....nah.
Sir Merv added the City needs to be tamed.....not holding breath...
He also added that Gordon Brown added to the chaos rather than assist in sorting it. I am not on any side in the political divide, but much emphasis has been put on the Conservative Pals.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Thank you Bern.
Yes there does need to be some changes in the bank system but at least we have seen some honesty from King over the BoE role, or lack of it, in the crisis. Sadly the FSA have not been as honest as King over their regulatory failures either. The tripartite system of regulation introduced by, you-know-who in 1997 is a mess.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
shutting the stable door after the horse as bolted springs to mind.who's ever fault it was.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Aviva shareholders continue the shareholders revolt against excessive salaries and bonuses for the elite squad.
Unfortunately shareholders have no teeth.Another system is required to control these excesses.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
the worms are turning but to little or no effect.