My son is a Police Officer. Not in Dover by the way! He tells me that you would not believe what abuse they have to put up with. But one thing I do know, my son is not a bully, and by extension, it cannot be stated that all police officers are bullies or that they are not doing their best in extremely difficult circumstances. It is my understanding that one of the nightmares of the job is all the paperwork associated with any arrest. However, I do agree that they should not be allowed to obscure their identification when on duty.
I do not see anyone saying all policemen are bullies - quite the opposite, I think we have all been careful NOT to say that and to offer support to the good ones. I understand how challenging it can be - I worked front line nursing and social work for years in a previous life and worked with the police on numerous occassions, saw it from many angles!! But that does not, by any means, excuse the outrageous and unacceptable violence and bullying tactics that have been used by some, and not only now, but remember the Miners Strike, during which many witnessed the sometimes frankly depraved violence used, sometimes as tactics and not just as knee-jerk response, which could in some cases be understood. Let's get it over with for good: There are some good coppers and some bad ones. We support the good ones and deplore the bad ones. The bad ones need to be accountable, publicly. Ok?
Hmm.. see your own post "some do their job well, but only a handful". Your own words!
The Police spend their days dealing with thiefs, rogues,
ruffians, drug dealers, alcohol and drug fueled louts, murderers, drink drivers.... etc. Surely it would be helpful to come up with some ideas about they can do their jobs better, coping with all this, and yes, trying to protect the general public, rather than being so negative. Could you do a better job? I should be genuinely interested to see how.
It is not my job to do. I know, I am not stupid, what the police deal with. I also know what I have seen with my own eyes, and most of it has been unplesant - not because of me, or how I have been, or because of any challenges. I really do support the police and I really do think there are some great coppers and some terrible coppers. There is, sadly, more visible and accessible evidence of the bad ones. if that changes, then I will be very happy.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
strange argument from diana there, most of us would be useless as firepersons, we still expect the official paid ones to the job correctly though.
The British police stopped being members of the community years ago. These days they are either being tools of the state or bouncers for big business interests.
Yes, but why always be negative? If you think everything or anything is being done wrongly, then surely you have ideas about how it might be done correctly? I'm just thinking it would be helpful, sometimes, to be positive. If the wrong kind of people are being recruited, then we should campaign for changes in recruitment. If the wrong kind of ethics are at the basis of the service, then these should also be changed. There must be some idea of how this could be achieved, or else you are just sitting back and letting it happen.
Perhaps I am fortunate in that all my experiences of the Police have been positive, both as a private citizen and in the course of my work (I, too was a nurse). Can I really be the only one?
I think it is excusable to be negative when witnessing someone batter someone or knock them to the ground, removes their ID and denies accountability. I thini it is reasonable to raise a concern if someone wearing a uniform which commands respect beats someone up, attacks them, wounds or kills them or contributes to their death, or breaks the law. I think it is reasonable to be somewhat negative in those circumstances, and I am , frankly pi**ed off with having to caveat everything so as not to offend those coppers who might be nice to their Mothers, see kittens across the road, smile winsomely at OAPs and wipe their boots before they batter down your door.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Ah now Bern... Your winding us up arent you!?
What we had was a guy pushed over for sure and the policeman owned up straight away...but we do not know the full circumstances re provocation etc as yet and once again they have carried out yet another post mortem yesterday , a third one, so somthing is looking odd...Of course incidents like this are unfortunate and we all Im sure wish they wouldnt happen but in the extreme heat of the kitchen you can sometimes get burnt. Oh no...I sound like Marco Pierre White.
Officers get hit with bricks, officers get hit with bottles, officers get assaulted, and so on etc etc..and yes maybe even while protecting your, or indeed my, property...so its not quite a black and white issue . Your painting a bit of a black picture.
Interestingly as an aside. I have written to a number of organisations to send me their press releases as and when, as I need as much info as I can get to do front page features. Sometimes press releases come in unsolicted too, which is good...but the only organisation so far who have refused to send me Press Releases are the Police and Jonathan Green their press officer. I am interested in giving the Police a fair press on the frontpage where there are very good viewing figures, but the upshot was that they said NO, .."we dont acknowledge Forums" or words close to that. I explained Im not just a forum but an overall magazine..but the answer stayed a resounding NO!! So there you are..I was only trying to serve the community by giving people out there the information I thought they should get.
PaulB, I was simply indicating that it is not always possible to be positive! We are surely allowed to express negativity about the Boys in Blue aren't we? That isn't an implication by any means that they are all thieving murdering ba**ards, just a gentle protest at things we see and witness. What annoys me so much is the implication that ANY critisism is unfounded or disallowed. That, surely, would be the start of a Police State?
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
Bern not at all...what you say there ... " the implication that ANY criticism is unfounded or disallowed" is not accurate. The entire media has been ablaze with criticism following this G20 event so its far from disallowed anywhere, quite the opposite. You can therefore rest easy in your bed that we are not on the threshold of a police state.
Oh dear!! I don't think I said any criticism is unfounded! And of course they should be accountable for their actions. I merely stated that not every policeman is a bullying brute and that sometimes people have positive experiences. They do not only deal with riots you know. There is all the day to day minutiae - domestice disputes, petty thieving, etc. And I still say that if a person is going to be negative there must be some idea, some where, of how things might be improved. But there, I obviously touched a very sore spot and I apologise if I caused offence.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
yep bern
Guest 663- Registered: 20 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,136
Sometimes it must be hard in the front line but in genral the police I have come in contact with do a pretty fair job but I gess it's like anything we are all open to criticism one way or another.
Guest 643- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,321
Diana, you talk a lot of sense and as you have a personal interest in our boys in blue you do know what you're talking about. What Jan says is right though, no matter what we belong to and whatever position we hold we are all open to criticism. Even in my modest job it happens. The main thing is where would we be without the police? I certainly feel a lot safer knowing they are out there protecting us, specially at night.
There's always a little truth behind every "Just kidding", a little emotion behind every "I don't care" and a little pain behind every "I'm ok".
If they turn up.....I have posted on another thread about this, and the drug-fest that went on for 2 years on our residential street near several schools a short, 5 minute stroll for the cop shop.