howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
despatches last night had a rather harrowing report on the treatment of the elderly in some of our hospitals.
a hidden camera caught some rather unpleasant incidents, one old chap that was on his last legs suffering from parkinson's disease, liver disease and a few others was verbally abused by two different nurses becuse he was unable to swallow his medication.
is it not time that there was a concerted campaign to root out rubbish staff?
As a nurse (retired) myself I just cannot understand this attitude. Did these people receive no training? Do we not go into the profession with the idea of doing some good? I remember taking an elderly lady into hospital because she had sustained an injury. The indian doctor (who had a very strong accent I might add) told her that if she was not willing to co-operate by telling him what was wrong with her he would not treat her. And this when I was standing there telling him she was demented and deaf and also what had happened! In general hospital staff are very dismissive of people with dementia and even refuse to care for them if the Nursing or Residential home where they live does not provide a carer. This has happened to my residents on more than one occasion.
I do not believe (from personal experience as a patient) that hospital staff, in general, are overworked. In any case, why should one expect to go to work and not work hard? Too many jobs these days involve a lazy trawl through the day, with frequent coffee and cigarette breaks, and use of the mobile phone and emails on personal business and people who do not have this type of job feel deprived.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Most certainly! Things like that should not happen, and are unacceptable. Nurses are paid staff, and have a contract to work according to regulations.
If they accepted the contract, and then do something unacceptable, they are in the wrong from a legal point of view. Abuse of ill and elderly people is a disgrace!
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
It was an eye opener watching last nights programme, shocking in the least. To see the unfortunate chap living out the last moments of his life at home suffering from emphysema was harrowing.
Upsetting to see his wife ringing the emergency services when he was having a heart attack, the paramedics saying that he needed morphine. Then trying to contact a district nurse to answer their phone to give him morphine with the doctors experiencing same even asking her has she been able to contact them
Abuse can occur in so many ways. Imagine just the horror of being stuck in a bed with cot-sides up, too feeble to pull yourself up or change position. You may get changed at regular intervals and heaved up the bed every four hours or so, but what you really need is to be moved when you want it. fed when you are hungry, given fluid when you are thirsty. I can begin to imagine what it must be like for a person in their 70's, 80's or 90's who are having to die under these circumstances, having had some personal experience of being entirely incapable, but luckily for me, not without a voice. It is not a pleasant thought.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Quite right, Diana. That's where all people tend to be equal, when it comes to depending on other people. We should see to it that our Country invests more in care for the infirm, where people who have a vocation and desire to work in this field are also emloyed, even if it meant spending more money, which it would.
Patients in need of other people to help them and care for them should be a top priority, and there is no room for budget saving and cost cutting here. I reckon we need to employ tens of thousands more people in the sphere of caring for other people who are ill or frail, and make sure that they are working not only for a salary, but because they have the vocation and will to carry out their work humanely.
Diana, I can only agree. I have been banging on about this for a long time. Nursing is so very different to how it was, and not in a good way. One of my staff who is currently untrained but an absolute diamond with pitch-perfect attitude, energy and enthusiasm, practical skills and common sense, recently back from Iraq where she served succesfully in the Army in HealthCare has been turned down for her nurse training because, although her exam results are respectable there were more people with straight As and it is a degree course. It is madness - she is exactly what nursing needs, and I can guarantee that some of those with straight As will be rubbish.
The standards of care are almost laughably low in too many areas, and those tasked with maintaining the standards, including CQC, are themselves corrupt and lazy. Too much paper, too little sense and heart.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
posh barry refers to the chap with emphysema, at least he died at home with a committed and loving wife lookin after him.
the sight of that helpless old chap being bullied by two nurses will stay in my mind for some time.
i am suprised that high educational attainment is as important as bern points out.
attitude must be the most important thing in a nurse, the rest can be taught.
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
I agree with you Howard, didn't they also say that the hospital pharmacist questioned the medication that the poor chap (Ken) was given in hospital, also he couldn't swallow and the way they pushed him to take his tablets was appalling. When they were changing his bedding they were talking over him as though he wasn't there, shocking.
Bang on, Howard. I am repeatedly appalled that academic attainment is prized more than care and heart. Common sense, respect, good manners and a willingness to work are the bedrock of nursing. The stuff we witness now, the abuse, casual neglect and callous carelessness is the result of a closed shop mentality, unions and representative bodies so far up themselves that it would take a periscope to retrieve them, the polar opposite of the required qualities being valued, and a general lack of manners in society. It is an outrage and about time we looked at it properly and admitted we have got it badly - very badly - wrong.
Bang on, Howard. I am repeatedly appalled that academic attainment is prized more than care and heart. Common sense, respect, good manners and a willingness to work are the bedrock of nursing. The stuff we witness now, the abuse, casual neglect and callous carelessness is the result of a closed shop mentality, unions and representative bodies so far up themselves that it would take a periscope to retrieve them, the polar opposite of the required qualities being valued, and a general lack of manners in society. It is an outrage and about time we looked at it properly and admitted we have got it badly - very badly - wrong.
Barry W-S, in my youth when in charge of a ward I sent a nurse home, instantly, for talking disrespectfully over a vulnerable dying patient. She was sacked. These days she would take out a grievance, be back at work the next day and probably get compensation for hurt feelings.
Guest 641- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,335
In this day and age you would probably be up against a tribunal for your actions. It's a Mad PC World we live and now die in today.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Please all re-read Bern's Blog. That says it all.
PG.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
Well, having just spent 10 days in Canterbury hospital, along with many other days in there as well as Kings College up in London, I can speak from personal first hand experience. Most of the nursing staff I couldn`t fault with only one or two making me wonder who passed them out. One nurse in Canterbury was constantly coming to ask the other night nurse for advice and she was constantly busy dealing with patients. I had an elderly gentleman in the bed next to me who, apart from talking to himself, was quite normal, and I had some interesting talks with him. He was intelligent and all there. However, the problems arose with him during the night when he became a pain in the neck talking to himself, calling out to the nurse, pressing the call button, and if nobody came, he`d bang something about on the table.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 677- Registered: 8 Jul 2008
- Posts: 150
I agree with Bern completely, I think the worst thing they did for nursing was make it a degree course.
My mum was a nurse, started her training in the 1960s with the only written qualifications being O levels. However, her personal qualifications outshone everything else. She was careing, concientious and I think most importantly prepared to do any work that would allow her patients to be treated with dignity, meaning that she used to clean the wards, the patients, speak to them like human beings instead of commodities and ensure that they were healthy, happy and safe.
Nurses these days, with their high end qualifications think cleaning is beneath them as are many other tasks that nurses used to do in my mums day. I think it's atitude that needs to change not just throwing more money after bad.
It's not the man in my life, its the life in my man!!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
not really peter, much as many of us have experienced the practices that bern's mum and the poor sods on last nights documentary went through there is the other side of the coin.
a while back i went for a gastroscopy at canterbury, after all the usual form filling a young scottish doctor came over and told me what would happen in a casual way.
once i was on the table thing a nurse explained about the stuff she was going to spray on my throat in a jokey way, then the doctor placed the tube down my throat and as it went further down casually explained what he could see whilst a rather pretty and friendly nurse
stroked the back of my neck and chatted to me.
anyway, i got computer print out of the procedure whilst i was in the recovery room that said "patient was unusually receptive of the procedure".
my only worry was that i would get billed for it on the way out.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
looks like we all posted at the same time.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
The above was what I viewed as maybe one of the biggest problems in hospitals today, lack of staff! Two nurses every night trying to deal with dispensing medication to the patients along with answering buzzers from patients requiring urgent attention ie soiled their beds or want the loo, but constantly interupted by other patients continueously pressing their buzzers for attention. One nurse did actually tell the chap next to me to shut up and go to sleep as he was keeping everyone awake. I had 10 nights of very little or no sleep. It`s so hard not to say the same yourself with so little sleep. It`s a big problem that needs resolving.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Nights have always been notoriously understaffed, but staffing is not the main issue. There is no doubt there are some good nurses, even some great ones, but they are, from my experience, far outweighed by the poor ones and hindered by a management that fails to grasp the important issues. It isn't about throwing money at it, it's about leadership, standards, and proper planning. It should not be down to luck or even personal charm that determines how we are treated when we are sick, old or vulnerable.
