Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
#1
I heard in passing on the radio FOUR this morning that the Euro is soaring as a currency. it is now worth more than 90p for the first time...or that might have been the first time in ages. This came across as somewhat baffling, as we all know only too well the current upheavel in the Eurozone. But this is beginning to clearly look like any talk of its demise has been greatly exagerated.
An expert from the New York stock exchange was giving it the thumbsup because countries like China and Sth Korea, very wealthy nations as we know, see it as the standard currency representing many nations and are very keen to trade with its members. The pound is falling in value and the Euro is gaining in value. Bad news for anyone planning a holiday in France etc. And as we say...now more than 90p against the value of the pound.
Also mentioned this morning on the radio was Mr Cameron's approach to the Chinese presidential trade contingent that visited our shores the other day. Mr Cameron took it upon himself to lecture in finger wagging style these Chinese leaders on their human rights record. This resulted in the Chinese being furiously miffed. They were furious. They came on a goodwill trade mission and Cameron lectured them like bootboys.
The result was they coudnt wait to leave and go and do business elsewhere. The signed a few paltry contracts here..went on to Germany where they were treated much better and signed huge contracts. A mighty boost for Germany, a mighty boost for the Euro.
Why oh why do we here in GB still think we have an empire, and approach these things like we still have an empire. China is the one with the power now, with the vast wealth...falling out with huge trading nations is poor strategy for our own workers here at home.
We can ask how we can help with human rights by all means, rather than take a super strong finger wagging holier than thou stance...other nations like China see this as an ignorant intrusion into their own state affairs. The UK lost out over this and none of our posturing will make a ha'pporth of diffference to anyone but ourselves. The classic own goal syndrome.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
#2
We should stop importing Chinese clothes and manufacture our own. Once, Chinese manufacts were vases and paintings on straw. It would be healthy for our economy if it returned to this previous state, and we did the other work ourselves at home.
This would create millions of jobs in Britain!
Well done, Gov.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#3
the chinese warned in advance that they would not be lectured on the issue of human rights.
maybe dave has not been told that they are the worlds second biggest economy.
Guest 715- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 2,438
#4
Perhaps when Cameron realises what a big opportunity has been missed by his actions he will ring them up and say "only joking" would not be his first U turn and will certainly not be his last!
Audere est facere.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#5
This is a no-win situation for him though.
If he had not said a dickie-bird about HR, he would have been condemned for not speaking out about it and accused of placing trade above Human Rights; so he did speak and he is still condemned.
I know you can't please all of the people all of the time, so what do you do ?
Roger
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
#6
A big fantasy, once again the BBC is sucking up to all things EU, swallow and recycling Brussels propaganda. So lets get back to the real world where the PIGS are struggling to cope in the Euro straight jacket. This is all going to come to a very nasty conclusion.
One thing I agree with PaulB on though is to forget this human rights rubbish and focus on our economic self-interest. Europe is on a steady economic decline while many Asian countries, unburdened by excessive government spending, red tape and interference are where future economic success will lay. Unless European countries drop their big-brother, big government, big spending policies they will become the new third world within a hundred years.
Currently no less than 4 of the biggest 10 economies in the world are in Europe, on current projections by 2050 no European country will be among the big 10. That is the scale of the problem we have and it is our problem as it is the jobs and prosperity of our children and us in our old-age that will be damaged.
That is why the UK should shake off the EU, get out and be free to pursue more sustainable economic policies of low red tape, minimal government, low taxes and low government spending. By this we will be able to compete and be more prosperous as the EU fades into a sad shadow of its former self.
Guest 683- Registered: 11 Feb 2009
- Posts: 1,052
#7
Barry
'forget this human rights rubbish'? In a solely economic sense this will work but if you want to bother yourself with dignity, respect and other humanitarian matters it does not.
It has been known for some time that the west is being caught and overtaken by the BRIC economies (Brazil, Russia, India & China) so it is a nonsense to say we need to compete - we cannot. Unless of course we go down a Brave New World scenario where we breed conditioned beings who are happy to work in appalling conditions for next to no money and certainly no rights.
I appreciate your view point but find it intellectually bankrupt and morally repugnant.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
#8
Perhaps you did not see the irony in that statement Mark about Human Rights.
On the rest of what you say, what an appallingly defeatist attitude.
To just accept that economically we are in decline and cannot compete I find quite appalling. That condemns future generations in this country to relative poverty and second class status in the world. I find that morally repugnant and intellectually bankrupt. It is not only the BRIC countries that are steaming ahead either.
I want the best of everything for everyone in this country and that can only come from economic progress. The market sectors in which we excel may change, the types of goods and services in which we will prosper in the future will almost certainly change as well, but we need not accept your 'management of decline' defeatist philosophy.
We must embrace that change and become more competitive. That does mean a change in political attitudes and philosophy including a smaller fitter state. We cannot go on as before if people want decent education, health and other services we have to change how we deliver them and get government off our backs. It will come - people will not be satisfied to just see that continuing decline, that is not in our nature.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
#9
I cannot see Europe becoming the new third world in a hundred years, the economies of Northern Europe are thriving. It is true that some economies within the zone are not thriving, as we all know. This problem will be fixed in time, one way or the other, then the EU could soar along with the four new biggies on the global block that Mark mentions there.
The Chinese own MG for example..so they are chasing our longheld manufacturing expertise in car making, so harmonising enterprise like that will be the way forward. We cannot compete though in many ways directly, their currency is artificially low and they can sell vast quantities of almost everything at lower prices than can be produced elsewhere, cetainly at lower prices than the EU can manage. But with our own specialist expertise we should seek to work in harmony with them. There is a Human Rights issue but it should be done alongside them, from within, rather than take a lecturing tone which accomplishes nothing.
Just to interject football into the debate. This very same thing was responsible for our total embarassing failure in securing the World Cup. We were outside the loop. We sent all the bigwigs along at the last moment, adopted a certain tone, but everyone turned their noses up at our smug representation. We werent insiders, we werent one of the guys in the backroom. A new philosophy was put forward after that ie..join in, be part of the daily team, changes come about that way. Not by lecturing from outside the loop.
Guest 663- Registered: 20 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,136
#10
Well said PaulB we cann't be on the out side, i work for a world wide company,we have to work with all around the globe or else we would not survive.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#11
i think that barryw is showing his blinkerd side with his views,most of the eu coutrys are growing faster than poor old britain.evan brazil has done better with a 7.5% gdp and still growing.
and besides all that i can see somtime in the near future britain will have to adopt the euro or die a greek death.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#12
some interesting points raised here, there does seem to be a general agreement that we are not the masters anymore.
we are still a powerhouse but others are more successful and drawing away from us.
dave showed himself up this week with the chinese and on his visits to india and pakistan he came across as condescending.
just a look at the faces in the audience told the story.
this is not a go at our prime minister i believe that much of our establishment have not sussed the new world order.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
#13
There is a lot of evidence that is being ignored here.
I have looked up one very interesting graph below to demonstrate just one point just how countries that are leaner and fitter, with a much smaller proportion of their GDP being taken by their public sectors are outstripping the more heavily burdened countries. This make very uncomfortable reading for lovers of big government and big brother statism like the Labour Party and EU advocates.
What is also important about this graph is that it is taken over a very long period and is very consistent.
It is worth noting that even in Communist China the State consumes around 26% of GDP compared to the UK at an appalling 53% of GDP.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
#14
It has just occured to me, that according to PaulB's claim, if I buy a euro today and sell it next week, I should get 2 euros.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
#15
Or should that be 2 pounds?
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#16
Trading inside or outside of the EURO zone is not a poblem; we are not restricted in any way.
Of course we are in a global market nowadays, that's the benefit of international trade - we can do business with anyone, anywhere, we don't have to have the EURO to prosper.
Roger
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#17
but it might come in handy to have roger.
barry that looks like an american graff,in which case it has an anti european bias.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
#18
Brian - graph source: OpenEurope, data source: OECD. It covers all 30 OECD nations
#19
Stats, damned stats. Always depends on the questions asked, the data incorporated and the data left out.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#20
stats are biased to the fact that they can prove people right or wrong.so in short i do not belive in stats.
