Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
10:0682743#1
A revolution is under way. The whole way we are being governed is changing. Everything from the way Secretaries of State are expected to take responsibility for their departments and make their own announcements to elected police chiefs - all is change and a true revolution in people power it is.
David Cameron is responsible for this. He spoke out against our Big State and centralised power in opposition and is now steadily dismantling it. The process is underway in ways often imperceptible to the public.
An excellent and interesting article about this appears today written by Benedict Brogan. Here are a couple of extracts and a link to the full article below.
"""""In Opposition he promised to hand away power, and in office he is doing just that. The consequences, I believe, promise a fundamental change to how this country is run. And what is all the more remarkable is how little we have noticed. Mr Cameron has embarked on a programme of decentralisation that will require Westminster, Whitehall and eventually the voters themselves to adjust. He wants to end our addiction to the all-providing state, and the Conservative Party's recent preference for central control over freedom.
What the Prime Minister is trying to do is audacious, because it defies what we have come to expect is the normal behaviour of politicians seeking to govern......
.......The process of centralisation began under Margaret Thatcher, as a legitimate response to Labour's mismanagement of the public finances. Those were the days when we had to ask: who governs Britain? In 1997 it was turned into a conspiracy to reorder society under the direction of Mr Brown, who launched a deliberate campaign to widen dependency on the state by dragging everyone from newborn babies to pensioners into a direct relationship with government through means-tested benefits.
Mr Cameron made reversing the damage one of his themes before the election, and in government has begun the task of delivering. """"""
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/benedictbrogan/100066350/david-cameron-is-giving-away-power-and-we%E2%80%99d-better-get-used-to-it/Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
2 December 2010
10:1282746#2
steady barry any one would think that the torys have gone soicalist,or in other words a blue labour party.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
10:4282755#3
Brian - no you have it the wrong way round.
The socialist way is Big Bossy Government with high taxes and high spending and state ownership. We have seen this with the records of every Labour government right from their mad nationalisation spree in 1945 right through to the Brown/Blair disaster.
The Conservative way traditionally has been low taxes, low spending and keeping out of people's lives. Other evidence of the Conservative 'power to the people' in action is privatisation and encouraging people to get shares in their own and other companies, right to buy so people can own their own home and so on. Mrs T did respond to some of the challenges of 1979 in centralising power over local government with capping and ring fencing but that aspect was an abberation and a way of dealing with the problem of the time.
Read the article on the link.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
2 December 2010
10:4382756#4
no barry i have got it right.be blue think red.
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
2 December 2010
10:4682758#5
So Barry the education proposals to fund schools directly from central government is dismantling the state and devolving power to the people?
Now that really is Ministry of Truth Newspeak
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
10:5582762#6
Ross - the finance originates from government anyway.
All this is is cuttting out the middleman and sending the money straight to schools without costs deducted. Where the dencentralisation is relevant here is in schools having more freedom how to best spend the money and over the education they provide.
Personally, as I have blogged, I would go further and issue education vouchers to parents so through these the money goes to the schools via parents adding in a greater element of parental power. I suspect that this will be a future logical development.
Brian - try reading what I said and commenting on that instead of just repeating a statement on which I have already offered clear evidence to the contrary. By challenging the specific evidence I have provided, if you can, we can get an interesting exchange going instead of pointless statements.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
2 December 2010
11:0182767#7
i did but still disagree with your statement.
2 December 2010
11:1182771#8
I have a few issues with too much People Power. There are some parents I would not want running a tap never mind a school; the great unwashed may not be alert to the nuances of rehabilitation or policing; how are non-medical people supposed to balance clinical and budget decisions? I agree there must be a better way, that we as a population should have more of a stake in governing, but we need to be cautious not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.........
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
13:0082802#9
Brian - so why not explain properly.
If yyou dont agree with something explain why not, provide evidence or justification for your view so we can have a proper conversation.
Bern - There are many people who I would not trust to run a whelk stall. the point is would they want to, would they have the motivation to do so. There are enough people who can and do get involved and other capable enough to do so. Why not give them freedom and responsibility over their lives.
At the end of the day results will count and it is best to just let people get on and take responsibility.
What is wrong is the idea that Government is the font of all wisdom and should do this, that and everything. Usually government IS THE problem.
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
2 December 2010
15:3582821#10
Sadly I do not trust those people (Toby Young springs to mind) that want to run free schools rather than become active in improving their local school
Oh on your last statement I absolutely agree with you Barry
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
17:2382845#11
Ross - there are all sorts of people looking to run free schools and they should not be tarred with the same brush. I am not too sure about Tony Young myself!!!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
2 December 2010
18:2982859#12
i have grave doubts about the free schools idea.
during the election campaign people who supported the idea were being wheeled out by michael gove to put the case.
i remember one "ordinary couple" extolling the virtues even though they had no experience in education, it turned out that both had masters degrees(one of them from cambridge).
the free school will be great for people like them that can put a professional case for funding through, whilst those without the education will be left far behind.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
2 December 2010
18:3082860#13
Howard - the opposite is true if you do not believe me you should look at the experience on which the policy is based, in Sweden.
2 December 2010
18:3382863#14
It is serious and un-addressed flaw in most "equality of access" debates. Those who know people or have the education to use the system effectively will always have better opportunities than those without. It isn't a judgement or a bad thing, it's just the way it is. It what perpetuates the Old School Tie, understandably, and what creates inverted snobbery and ignorant resentment. And you cannot "un-educate" or "de-network" people, and you cannot seriously expect anyone NOT to use whatever skills and contacts they have to do the best for themselves and their families. It would be absurd. The best way to utilise people skills appropriately and fairly is to systemise it, to structure things so that those who can, do and are rewarded, and that in doing so others who cannot are enabled.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
3 December 2010
10:2682987#15
Yes let's look at Sweden. The Conservatives have been going on about Sweden for a long time, but this is only because they can see elements which they can exploit and justify them on the basis that the education in Sweden is a successful system. Unfortunately they are not actually prepared to back this up with real policy.
The main difference between our two systems is that Sweden values education more. Pupil premiums are higher and classes smaller, all brought about by higher taxation and more of this money going to education. They value it so much that university fees are free, you know, free the opposite from this government's plans.
Additionally their approach is far more egalitarian with most pupils attending comprehensive schools and none of this old fashioned 2tier/grammar school system. Yes 'free schools' exist but are a way of opting for private education but still receiving your premium from the state. This is what the Conservatives like! Basically they don't think it's fair that people that go to private schools should pay twice. Of course very little will change other than those with money will have more. Parents who can't afford to top up their vouchers will be in exactly the same position, but probably stuck with schools with PFI arrangements, "today children maths is brought to you by Tesco".
And just to let you know how it works in the government, you know as DC keeps telling us about 'fairness'. This lady is doing the advising!!!
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2010/oct/27/michael-gove-adviser-free-schools-contracthoward mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
3 December 2010
10:3282988#16
so much for the new transparency, honesty and openness in government.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
3 December 2010
11:0582999#17
Very selective there DT1 - The fact is there is a revolution going on in Sweden with lower taxes, and a resurgence of the free market in everything, including schools....
3 December 2010
11:0883000#18
Nicely flagged up DT1. Thank you.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
3 December 2010
11:4383008#19
This maybe the case Barry and probably result in them screwing the good system they have. However the model the Conservatives keep promoting IS the result of high taxation and state investment, unfortunately they are not prepared to spend, something the last government did do for education (although not all decisions were good).
I'm not selective, it's just a shame the same can't be said about our schools.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
3 December 2010
13:4383028#20
More choice, more selection, more streaming, more discipline - a return of the cane. Tougher exams and less course work, fewer going to Uni, more technical schooling.....
And a full scale privatisation of the education system with parent power through vouchers.
Thats what we need DT1, I dont expect you to agree with much of that though!
