Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
roger,the definition of fair is varable,depending on ones values.yours seems a victorean/thatcherite.
what would happen if your pension went down and you having to work longer for less,wouldnt you feal disgrunted.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
Not under the circumstances Brian - those within ten years of retirement are not affected.
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i believe the improved offer from dave came in after the union members were ballotted.
if the strike goes ahead then the offer is withdrawn.
since there is no time to ballot the members this is a very shrewd move from dave who would benefit politically from any strike action going ahead.
Guest 662- Registered: 18 Mar 2008
- Posts: 325
I am relieved to hear that Sue and others are not striking on Wednesday. If only some of our local school teachers, ta's and dinner ladies were to act so selflessly!!
Personally, I am a little aggrieved that the School I volunteer at (key word is volunteer aka unpaid) is closed except for one class, due to the amount of staff on strike. Has made me think twice about whether I will continue to support them for free and I hope that other volunteers in these establishments take note.
We are in a recession, working mothers have to take a day off or pay extra for childcare. Small businesses will be affected by the fact that so many people will be off as they need to take care of their children. Here in Dover we have a large number of people currently wondering 1. if they will be paid this month and 2. if they will still have a job at all, so I am sorry that the teachers etc.. are not happy perhaps they should be thankful they have a job at all.
Havent felt this strongly about something for a long time and as you all know i dont do politics.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,888
Sheli,
I wonder how many of those on strike genuinely want to strike and how many are simply sheep following union orders and just thinking of having a day off.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
Probably quite a lot Jan - good people led by donkeys.
Roger
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
sheli
firstly a lot of people state they are not political then go on to make a political statement and thats fine.
JAN/ROGER
The unions were asked to ballot which they did now its up to individuals if they choose to support the club they joined.
funny because the govt said people wont join the strike
they are now preparing for massive walk outs
believe me roger/jan people don't strike lightly, many of the unions on strike wednesday have never ballotted its members before, that shows the evel of disgust at this cobbled together govt.
howard;
you are of course correct talks had been going on since february and then stopped in november. as soon as the unions mentioned ballots and results known the govt knowing it was to late to re ballot put in a new offer, one that already some of the major unions are already rejecting(but remember the govt are refusing to meet the unions at this time) even the non striking nursing union RCN is considering balloting its members!!!!!!!
of course howard this is a tactical move by the cobbled together govt, but i feel it will backfire on them, and has just put another nail in the lib dem coffin.
All the unions interviewed are wanting to get wednesday out the way and get to meaningful talks, whilst the lib dems play games which the public see through
the tories are far more sinister are there usual confrontational attitude will do little to resolve this dispute
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Just a couple of observations. Around 29% of union members voted. However many of them voted for a strike it is still a small number of people, relatively speaking. And I didn't know until this week that teachers are only contracted to work 32.5 hours full time, as a rule. Nice work if you can get it.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
In terms of turnout, I thought the various teaching unions were between 35 and 40%, with those in favour of strike action being between 80 and 90%. of course the ballots weren't just about pensions (of which I think need some kind of reform).
You're right Bern, it is a small number of people, relatively speaking. But then again it is a vast amount more (proportionally) than those who voted in our current government.
True, and that doesn't make either outcome right. And 80% of 30% isn't a huge amount, realistically.
Hi Keith , which of the unions have never balloted for a strike before ? I was aware of the Headteachers ( I forget the real name ) but didnt realise there where others who had never in thier history balloted for strike action .
The unions do need to be very careful that they have correctly follwed exact process on the ballot , because if I where an employer I would analyze the information after a strike and then seek damages etc etc from the organizations and indeed individual members , who would then be forced to seek redress from the union , after the event which would potentially cripple the unions involved and therefore the Labour party , as funding dried up .
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
surprised that darren did not comment on the contracted hours.
over the years i have known many teachers directly and indirectly and all that i have known spend endless hours outside of school preparing or marking lessons, not forgetting the time spent on reading up the next lot of rubbish from the politicians changing everything around for no apparent improvement in results.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
sarah;
hello there, of course the set up is totally in favour of employers as you say, and thats one of the problems, rather than try to sit down in an even playing field, as you say employers often dont want the hassle of unions thus take routes as you suggest.
of course you can see this kind of attitude with the present cobbled together tory administered govt which is threatening in its statements more recently, rather than trying to find ways to resolve the dispute.
yes the head teachers union is one such union taking action never takn before
i did say the other being the Royal; college of nursing a non militant group with a non strike agreement but even they are to ballot there members.
so its looking grim
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Thanks Keith , I thought you meant another union who where involved in the current dispute , I am not confident that the RCN would ever ballot its membership for any meaningful type of strike action .
The thing that the unions involved in the current dipsute need to keep at the forefront of thier thinking is the BA/Unite dispute which was eventually settled because the union couldnt cope with the legal challenges and costs of maintaining the action. Unison and Unite are huge organizations but membership is dropping and even thier coffers are not limitless , which of course has a direct knock on to the Labour Party with Unison being its biggest funder . I would wait and see what the employers action is after any actions that are taken on Wednesday
Keith, it is absolutely the other way around. There are people who are either still employed inappropriately or who have won huge payouts because the system is weighted towards them and away from employers. The public sector is the worst for this, which has directly led to crap workers being booted upwards because equally crap managers fail to address it because it is difficult and the chaos and shambles we see in the NHS and social services is the reward.
It is very dificult to get fired from the NHS a sideways or upwards promotion with "training" is often the action taken for under performance
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,706
Funny how so many get really bothered about the absolute numbers voting in favour of the motion when it is a strike ballot but not when it is a general or local election
Both are examples of democracy in action
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
My personal view is that voting in general elections should be made compulsory
#57 - Ross you are right, of course, but there is f'all we can do about the government who seem to elect themselves with no bother at all and little reference to the will of the people, but we can challenge a body of people claiming to represent their members who in reality are taking out on strike many more people than actually asked to go out on strike. Yes, that may have been the result of the apathy of the voters (the old story) but they are taking an action, to the detriment of a huge number of people, on the vote of a small minority.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
yes bern we can question the apathy of both sections
both govt elections and union ballots
that sad we are where we are, we certainly shouldnt class all public workers in the way you have bern
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS