Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Although it would appear that the BBC have a difficulty telling the difference between 'sea defences' and 'coastal defences', it now looks as if English Heritage are coming around to seeing the benefits to Dover and the nation of situating an appropriate National War Memorial here in Dover. Most of us realise that this is the most appropriate site for it and it surely time that we put our hearts into it and pushed the powers that be to approve it, in time for the hundredth anniversary of the start of WW1.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-18719300Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
got to push hard on this as the aniversary is about 2 years away now,so come on people lets have some people power to push for this to be done intime.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
the question is who do we push to in turn push someone else.
not that long before the anniversary of the outbreak of the great war.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
While I am not a big fan of such things, I am affected...
Build it
build it stark
for all to view
against the sky
against the sea
make it black
against the blue
Build it
build it well
and craft it true
against the Why?
against the We?
make it tell
against the You!
Build it
build it now
form it as new
against the sky
against the sea
make it a vow
'One Empty Shoe'
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
Writing to English Heritage supporting the proposal and asking when it can be done would be a good start as their permission is key to the site.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
writing to or e mailing english heritage is as productive as trying to get a response from the environment agency.
never even an acknowledgement from either.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Who is supposed to pay for all this?
The Army is being reduced in numbers by over one fifth due to lack of funds, as well as the Police. Navy and Air Force likewise.
There is no money for this sort of trivia on Western Heights.
I might write a letter to English Heritage explaining that our Heritage would be at risk with millions of people marching up thee to read millions of names.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
A change of tune there Alex, you have previously denied that people would visit in any numbers.
The design has been gathering praise from all over as indicated by this article.
http://www.landscapeinstitute.org/news/index.php/news_articles/view/craftpegg_to_create_national_war_memorial/Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
The historian Max Hastings also said a lot about Britain's lack of just such a memorial as is proposed.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2156699/Turning-backs-Britains-fallen.html
If you don't feel like writing to English Heritage (even if they don't respond they do read them) then try writing to the local and national papers showing support and why Dover is the right place for a National War Memorial.
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Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
SWWood- Location: Dover
- Registered: 30 May 2012
- Posts: 261
"There is no money for this sort of trivia on Western Heights"
Trivia Alex? I can think of very few things less trivial than this proposed memorial. We are talking about a memorial which would be both respectful to those who have died, as well as educational for those of us who can never fully understand the sacrifices made. "Trivia" seems a pretty poor choice of words, if I may say so.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
The question is, can such a memorial be built on a Scheduled National Monument?
Emotive arguments are of no avail here, it's the technical questions that need addressing. What traffic would be generated, has anyone estimated how much traffic would pass through Dover owing to such a memorial.
Do we have the road capacity for such extra traffic, and what are existing pollution levels in Dover already? By how much would these pollution levels rise?
Where would the cars park, assuming someone can give us an estimate on how many people would be expected to visit such a memorial?
And please don't come with "park and ride" without first telling us WHERE the cars/ buses would actually park!
Answers on an A4 format sheet please!
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
alex in a word yes.of course there is a small down side but what differance would it make with things as they are and getting worse over the next 10 years or so.
Guest 719- Registered: 11 Jul 2011
- Posts: 443
Yorkshire Born And Yorkshire Bred
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
ted why stop there,folkstone road is as good as any park and ride.along with river,tower hamlets and aycliffe.
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
On parking, there are 470 spaces planned for the DTIZ and an additional 500 at the station. The 61 bus regularly has to divert over Military Road so making an adjustment to the route would mean 4 buses an hour with very little change in the timetables.
The proposed site (originally designated for housing) used to have the old barracks, long since demolished (1965) and was well recorded.
Alex in previous threads on this you have consistently refuted that such a memorial would bring enough people into Dover to make it a positive benefit for the town, now you are worrying about huge numbers of visitors. A little consistency would help with your arguments.
I keep looking but the only listed building I can find in the area is the administration block in the Removals Centre. This proposal does not threaten that and would prove a benefit and incentive for preservation work on the Drop Redoubt and Grand Shaft.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
The entire area is a scheduled ancient monument bar the areas where modern construction has already happened:
http://gisservices.english-heritage.org.uk/printwebservicehle/StatutoryPrint.svc/23259/HLE_A4L_NoGrade|HLE_A3L_NoGrade.pdf
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 644- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,214
Nice three-page coverage of the plans in the new issue of 'Britain At War' in the shops today. It can be found in Smiths and most other local newsagents.
Guest 670- Registered: 23 Apr 2008
- Posts: 573
The war has been over for 67 years and whilst I am very aware of all those that gave their lives for this country, why do we need a memorial, it could quite easily be built at Capel near to the BofBmemorial
Why does Dover continually rely on the past, is there no future?
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
look at the past to move forward to the presant and future.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
I did bethink myself to search out the first instance of a 'War Memorial', but it occurred to me that they go way-back.
"The writing is on the wall."
We have all heard that expression, I'm sure. It comes from the depiction of warfare in the deeply barbaric age of Babylon, I think though from a little further east, where the way to the throne room was by a long passageway, on the walls of which were depicted in graphic detail the fate of those foolhardy enough to defy the rule of the king. Thus all ambassadors were 'advised' on how to conduct themselves.
The next instance that springs to mind, moving forward through history, is a stone column of ancient Egypt. Which again, though more for public consumption, made much of the glory of the king (and side-stepped reality a fair bit).
It seems to me that things have not moved-on much from those days. True, these days we hear much more about the sacrifice and the "let this be a lesson to us all" stuff, but, if lesson there is, it is one we are destined to unlearn even before we learn it.
It's the 'for public consumption' aspect that is most troubling for me.
Can we imagine a father with his young son standing in front of such an edifice disclaiming, "One day son you too could have your name on this."?
Perhaps I should shut-up, and heed the writing on the wall?
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.