Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
I was at Orgreave and I know what happened there.
Part of me wants to just forget it; to leave it all behind but justice is the framework our society.
Without true justice, bad things happen, when bad things happen, we have to learn from them and put them right.
Time does heal wounds but the injustice that was served upon 98% of ordinary miners, being treated like animals and even worse, being called the "enemy within" we must make sure that the truth come's out.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01nj32j"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
an inquiry is not before time some of the scenes there were disgusting, justice must be seen to be done.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
Garyc
you are so right,
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
"South Yorkshire Police said it would consider whether a review was needed." [Quote from the link at #1]
Eye read...
'South Yorkshire chief constable David Crompton was profusely apologetic when the findings of the Hillsborough were released last month.
He issued a statement saying:"South Yorkshire Police is a very different place in 2012 from what it was 23 years ago and we will be fully open and transparent in helping to find answers to the questions posed by the panel today." He said there could not be a cover-up in the force today because the practices prevailing in the 1980's in no way correspond to "the sorts of standards of openness and transparency that any of us would expect these days".'
However. One former South Yorkshire Policeman, who was one of those to discover his 1989 statement had been altered without his knowledge, was contacted by post a week before the Hillsborough report was published and advised not to speak to the media.
While I am sure that we have much to learn about the ins and outs of how the State conducted itself back then I doubt that, while we are Governed by Thatcherite supporters and apologists, much would see the light of day.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i knew someone from the met that was drafted in and they were told to provoke the strikers in order to ensure violent scenes.
a lot of police officers from outside of south yorkshire earned good money over the period of the strike.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
there are many traumatic things that could be highlighted
it was not a good time
and certainly the police have a lot to answer for during the miners year long dispute
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Trying to find excuses for the picket line thugs....
Heard it all now.
There are no excuses for the contemptible behaviour of striking miners on the picket line rioting and trying to bully and intimidate people from going about their lawful jobs.
The police were doing their duty protecting those going about their business. If, and its a big if, any individual police officer was unprofessional in doing their duty then they are a bad as Scargills thugs were.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
Phew!
I'm glad I got my 'retaliation' in first.
Yes Howard I too know of the wonders of abundant overtime and away from home money. I had a friend whose son did very well out of his time up north.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
coppers were different in those times tom, many of them were just cowardly thugs that when given riot equipment took sadistic pleasure in doling out gratuitous violence.
many of the police in the pit villages refused to get involved.
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,707
Barry as someone who was on picket lines during that period I saw more instances of people in police uniforms offering intimidation, threats and actual violence than I did those in the ordinary gear of the picket line. As to whether they were actual police officers and which force they were with was often impossible to tell as police numbers were hidden or removed etc.
Yes some members of the picket lines behaved badly and deserve to be condemned for that behaviour.
Yes Police Officers behaved badly and broke the law and they too should be condemned for that behaviour.
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
# 7....``well balanced opinion.......nah
# 9 ..we have personal evidence of the unacceptable police violence at Tilmanstone,in Barville and Pike road and the open
taunting of the police waving their wage packets at the miners,who were living on donated food supplies
Guest 671- Registered: 4 May 2008
- Posts: 2,095
At Orgreave, I cannot comment on what happened on the front lines by the gates, because I never got that far. We were stopped and grouped together, so that we could not join the other pickets.
We were isolated from the others and were kept in a very large group on the road. We had been there a few hours, some lads playing football others just chatting, some chanting at the police. There was no trouble from us whatsoever, some were even chatting and laughing with the police.
Then in the early afternoon, without warning, we were surrounded and herded into a field.
The mood had totally changed, it was no longer friendly and they would not say why we were being moved. I noticed others were being forced into the same field, very roughly and tempers were beginning to flare. It was obvious we were being provoked into retaliating but we were unsure why because up till then we had not shown any hostility or gave them any problems.
Then there was a break in the police ranks and the Horse's came charging at us. It was totally un-provoked and hideously frightening. We ran in all directions, some miners were injured by other miners, simply trying to escape. Others fled leaving cloths and belongings behind, never going back; some were injured by the horses, by the police and by falling down trying to escape.
Fortunately, I was not injured and I made my way back to my car and left.
Leaving without knowing what had happened to my friends and knowing that we had not provoked this violence, has scared me for life.
I have put the strike behind me and moved on but I cannot put that day behind me and never will.
It was not confined to Yorkshire police during the strike. Kent Miners were stopped at the Dartford tunnel and turned away. This action was challenged in court but deemed to be legal; however the senior officer who ordered the stoppage, has now retired and stated on air that he was acting under orders and he believed his actions were illegal.
I spent most of the strike in an office, giving talks at meetings but I did attend a picket at Wivenhoe, Essex. I was stood at the front near the gates of a coal yard where we were waiting to talk to the lorry drivers moving coal. I was alarmed that we were getting pushed from behind and that stones were being thrown from behind. I was told that they were not miners; just trouble makers and that they were always there. I could not make my way back, so I asked to speak to a senior officer. After being ignored for ages and made to plead, I was eventually frog marched to a senior officer. I explained that we wanted no part in or was responsible for, the throwing of stones and the pushing. I asked for 2 men, me and another to be allowed to talk to incoming lorry drivers and in return I would move the pickets further back away from the gates. He turned round to my escort and told him to make sure that I was the first one arrested when the first lorry arrived. I was put back in the front of the line and as the first lorry arrived, we were shoved from behind and I hit the ground in seconds. I was then dragged by my b_lls to a van screaming and swearing.
About 30 were arrested that day and when it came to court, I was eagerly waiting to have my say to the judge about the pc who arrested me(I could identify him today) but stood in the dock claiming to be the arresting officer was most definitely, not the one who arrested me. I informed my solicitor, the judge insisted the pc in the dock refer to his book and when he could not, my case was dismissed, as were most, if not all, of the other cases. I wanted to pursue it further back then but i was told it would not happen.
Perhaps now is the time?
"My New Year's Resolution, is to try and emulate Marek's level of chilled out, thoughtfulness and humour towards other forumites and not lose my decorum"
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
Thank you for your exposition Gary.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Guest 705- Registered: 23 Sep 2010
- Posts: 661
That is one harrowing story...go for it Gary-every decent, law abiding citizen will be behind you...
Never give up...
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
Alarming story, good luck with it Gary.
I know that not all Police were wonderful and not all miners were bad and some frightening things happened to and by both sides.
Roger
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
No-one is saying all police were perfect or that all the strikers were thugs but there can be no excuse for the scenes we witnessed daily on our screens of violence and intimidation by pickets aimed at people going to work. The Trade Union movement in the 60's. 70's and early 80's epitomised bullying and intimidation whether it was on picket lines or in mass meetings. Once secret ballots were introduced it seriously limited their bullying tendencies.
Incidentally - I was a Union member for a period in the 70's though a respectable one that had cleaned up its act thanks to Eric Hammond and Frank Chapple.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
# 16...lets relax from our personal preconcert to understand and consider that when people are desperate and can see no way
to avoid destitution...matters will erupt.
It is the people who cause the desperate circumstances that need to consider the consequences of `their`actions / policies
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Reg, are you referring to Thatcher or Scargill?

I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
# 17...refers.
During the miners strike I was teaching at a school in Cliftonville and my route to work took me along Barville Rd to the A256
One morning there were lots of police and miners suddenly running from Pike Rd onto Barville Rd.to A256
Miners being chased by the police. I had to stop my car and was first in a line of cars to stop. The police caught up with about 3 miners and pushed them up against the steep bank on the left hand side of the road where they proceeded to push/punch and kick them.
I got out of my car and asked the policeman who was now standing in front of the line of cars what was going on, but I didn't get an answer. I was determined not to move until I had left my contact details with the police so in the end a more senior officer came and took them and I continued to school.
Weeks went by but I heard nothing and became concerned that my details had not been passed on. I then contacted the police to see what was happening.
Two senior officers from Maidstone ( lots of scrambled egg on their uniform) then visited my home. Reg came home from work in London to be with me. These officers explained to us that my only choice was to take out a private prosecution against the police. This I couldn't understand as I was only a witness to what had happened and had not been involved in any way myself.
Reg and I decided that this couldn't be right so we went to see a solicitor in Castle Street Dover to see if they could clarify the situation.
I told my story and was immediately informed that I was a missing witness that they had been trying to find via the local paper.
The out come of all this was me being called as a witness at Folkestone Court. I made my statement and answered questions (shaking like a leaf) to a courtroom packed with policemen in uniform and I have to say that I felt very intimidated and I was only recording what I had witnessed.
The miners were not convicted but it was a `difficult`process to obtain justice.
Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Sorry signed Wendy Hansell.