howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
who are you replying to paul?
I do hope that it is me , as I have remembered that I got an art prize at school that I would like to mention.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
and the prize at school was???(that realy gets the mind going lol)
i was sub prefect for a time
anyway back to the thread;
alexander;
i think all views will always be good for those of us with open minds able to take on board the many differing viewpoints
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Aw shucks Keith I wanted to say that along with a friend our second book is just at proof stage, we are both working on our own next books and have spend 10+ years doing guided walks for EH and the White Cliffs Counryside Project (but I can't swim very well!!)
Been nice knowing you :)
Dont worry Paul , I can tow you across water , and draw a picture of the event to commemorate the moment
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
cleaver girl,will you be singing moon river at the same time.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
When at the meeting yesterday in Braddon, it was a joy to see so many local people intent on discussing the future of our Western Heights, to preserve our Heritage.
And the petition, which gained hundreds of signatures in two hours two weeks ago, would have had thousands of signatures in just 10 hours, in just two streets of Dover!
Yes, it would have the overwhelming support of people in Britain and of visitors from far and wide across the seas had it been presented over a period of weeks in Dover!
I have just noticed the departure of a handful of people from any capability of presenting an opposed argument to the one which we presented, we the many of us of Dover who are for preserving our Heritage.
Lorraine is fully justified , suffice to see the sad remarks of a hand full who opposed us, whereas the many supported us, indeed are with us in the same cause!
As is English Heritage and protect Kent.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
alexander;
i am pleased the town and pier wards braddon group may well start up a community group, which will hopefully add to the debate.
i continue to pose the question
if the developement was not to happen, and bearing in mind those on the neg and pos side of this debate both having little confidence in E H
Where will the dosh come from if not the E H???
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
#1307 - be nice if people showed an amount of 'patriotism' and actually did something to help before this threat to the views from their gardens...
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Keith, the ideas are inspiring and realistic.
We'd be looking at a working bases with DDC to build on practical foundations, which would see a departure from the proposition of using W.H. as a means of attracting thousands of more residents to Dover through houses, but rather on being open to visitors to enjoy.
The new-housing policy as set out for Whitfield and other areas outside Dover - and within - is controversial enough, so we'd like to separate W.H. and Farthingloe from this housing policy and concentrate on areas of public enjoyment, with a harmony of green nature, sea views, and Scheduled National Monument, combined with the history of the area and the present.
Pathways for walks in areas of Outstanding Beauty, a visitors centre, a community centre, open venues for a village fair, guided tours around the military structures, displays for the Public, these are being discussed at Braddon, and Lorraine is greatly appreciated among us.
We're not seeking a confrontation with DDC, but have reserves regards the Planning Office and its ambitions, and for this reason, undue comments against Lorraine can be considered equally as being such against all of us.
But I an glad to know you are interested, Keith. Only, the dialogue with DDC at present is more centred on the controversy regards the CGI proposals, and we need to put this behind us, and open a new page for the future, where speculation is ruled out, and a realistic, Community based relationship is upheld.
Hopefully you will be open to our cause, Keith. As said, we're talking here of a village community, and of the wider Dover Congregation.
SWWood- Location: Dover
- Registered: 30 May 2012
- Posts: 261
Alexander, was the NOT YET (but hopefully soon to be) proposed war memorial discussed at your meeting? Also, how do you intend to get visitors to the Heights without increasing traffic levels?
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Rather sad to try steal from the combined efforts of WHPS and WCCP who have and are working on these aims and projects for the last 20 odd years rather than trying to work with them :O
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Talking to DDC you will then be put in contact with WCCP who will tell you how they have struggled for funding during that time and how they have spent years on a large funding application over several years for the chalk grassland and heritage between Dover and Folkestone.....
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Been nice knowing you :)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
yet again paul who are you replying to?
1300 posts here it gets confusing.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,895
I should think Paul is replying to Alexander as usual
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Aha replying to #1310 - I am also intrigued to know how scheduled monument laws can be circumvented to build a village hall and visitor centre, and why Alexander has changed his tune and now actually wants visitors to the Heights !!
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Obviously, Paul, he is very open-minded and has been influenced by others in his group and modified his views accordingly.
Unlike the rest of us who want the Heights despoiled for commercial gain at all costs.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Stuart, mention was made of the War Memorial. My view is that the issue is separate from the present CGI one among the group. The impression I have is that the village is not in a situation to discuss it while the CGI proposals are on the table, as it is all too overwhelming.
Paul recently wrote of the prospect of hundreds of thousands of visitors to a War Memorial on the Heights, each year, add that to the hotel and the conference centre, and then the 94 houses proposed for Braddon, combine all the traffic, and you'll see that it is all to overpowering for the communities up there.
My worry is that DDC are not giving fair treatment to the residents and are potentially destroying their community life, as they have proven to be capable of doing with Sholden and Whitfield.
We did have a delegation from Sholden at the second meeting, who expressed their support, and the last words the lady from Sholden said to me were: "we will win!"
She was referring to Sholden too. People still have hope, they are hoping what they see as a terrible destiny can be reversed.
I received this exact same message from Whitfield in November 2010 or there about, that many people there hope the present economic crisis will prevent DDC's development plans from going ahead to the extent the Planning Office have proposed.
I did bring this up at the time on the Forum, but Paul Watkins spoke of knee-jerk reactions, no matter who they came from. I wasn't just speaking for myself!
I am not sure if DDC Planning is aware that they may be ruining the lives of whole communities, and possibly forcing people out of despair to abandon their home village and migrate elsewhere.
We must stand up for the cause of Freedom and Democracy, for civic society where people and communities count and have the right to take part in the decisions that regard their future.
Where people are not treated as on Animal Farm, where an outcry against such massive intrusion in the peaceful life of a community is not a "knee-jerk reaction".
We must not allow ourselves to degenerate into a society of local government tyranny, where massive investment schemes involving developers and money to the Council completely wipe out all objections, whether on future employment, the right to continue enjoying a peaceful environment, concerns of increased traffic and pollution or any other concerns.
Hence, it is essential that DDC start an open dialogue with the Western Heights community, yet not based on speculative development, on an imposition already decided in the Planning room (see Corporate Plan 2012-16), but on the expressed will of the majority of people.
The petition has spoken clearly: in two hours, hundreds of signatures from all over Dover, from Britain, Canada, Australia...
We would have had thousands of signatures in 10 hours, in just two streets!
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
wow
! im sure others will reply further, but lets unpick some of your comments alexander;l
1; I continue to be unaware of any poster who hss closed there eyes to open
debate, what i have seen is a majority of people remaining undecided on any
proposal, also some could be seen to be partly in favour of some of the
developement but still await the plans.
then we have 2 or 3 posters opposed to any develement which is also there
right to air there views in this wonderful forum that allows such a debate
to take place.
2; Won't get heavily involved in the whitfield development but as iv stated
before had it been correct that people were up in arms over the
development they would have voted out those who proposed the
development(conservatives) but they didnt, which indicsates people in
whitfield in the majority must be in favour of the development
3'; I'm all for people standing up to, and for freedom of speech, but with this
you should accept alexander it appears the democratic route you may be
in the minority, do you still then accept democratic decisions?
4; The petition will be considered by the council as will all the other comments
both for and against the proposal when it does come forward.
you do confuse democracy with outnumbered others concerns
within this thread we see a lot of views coming forward, and whilst im no
fan of the planning dept on ddc, we do have to wait for the proposals to
come forward, then all put our views forward both for/against any
proposal but if the planning dept accepts the majority view on development
thats also democracy isn't it?
5; im not sure if i lived in western heights i would want my future decided by
someone in canada, but hey ho thats democracy i suppose.
all in all its all in the melting pot, and its right that those in favour/against/
undecided continue to debate, but it has to be on realistic terms,
i do ask again alexander,
your plans sound very nice, but to do part/all of the future plans you propose
who's going to pay?
it won't be ddc they aint got no dosh, so please can you answer this for me
thankyou
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS