Guest 716- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 4,010
Totally agree...........ie # 1.....
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
agree on that one mark, the eu has never been seriously debated, my favourite was ted heath who just accused people of being backward if they were not happy with political integration.
the main players i.e. germany and france are now looking at devolving powers back to national governments which puts a new complexion on the issue, not just us that want more say on how we are run.
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
debate goes on
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Mark Robson wrote:The danger is wider than an EU referendum and is about an ill informed electorate. We won't get an open and honest debate on any of the issues and we will be left voting on our prejudices. "Bread and circus" politics means very few have a grasp of the complete picture - or even want to - and this suits politicians and policy makers inside and outside government.
Mark - how typical .... that is just typical of the patronising attitude that is so disgusting about the EU.
What you are saying is that you know better than the ignorant unwashed masses. An attitude demonstrated by countries being told to take referenda again when the 'right' result (for the EU) is not forthcoming.
You have just provided one major reason why we must get out to the suffocating fascist EU.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
To be fair on this one
wasn't there a country that wanted to pull out but the electorate voted no
so they had another vote in the hope the electorate would change there minds
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Guest 683- Registered: 11 Feb 2009
- Posts: 1,052
Barry, before you do yourself a mischief. Take a deep breath, think of a happy place, park YOUR patronising attitude and re-read what I wrote?
Guest 745- Registered: 27 Mar 2012
- Posts: 3,370
Barry
One big problem Barry for the conservatives,
The welsh Scottish and lots of the north will not vote Tory.
And Coupled with this is ,Cameron will be opening the uk doors to Bulgaria and Romania in January.
And your rich donor issues will build as labour harvest the moving away of money linked with the unions.
At the same time the union's political war chests, will be overflowing as they prepare to poor crap all over ukip and the conservative and all labour rightwing candidates.
Should be interesting.
Keith s do you think labour should give the uk voters an EU referendum ?
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
Keith B - do not be fooled by the waffle from Milliminor. What he is saying will not reduce the amount paid by the Unions by a penny, the money will be paid by different channels. They will not give up their evil influence on Labour and Labour will do nothing to cut off their financial lifeline.
I actually support reform, a maximum of £50k a year from any individual or organisation for instance. That means of course that donations from businesses and from Unions will be limited to that. Care would have to be taken to make sure back-channels are not abused to boost that.
What I am against is a subsidy from taxpayers going to political parties or trade unions.
The Scottish problem is certain a big one but is nothing new.
Mark - I stand by what I said you evoked the exact same patronising attitude of the EU towards we the unwashed. The main problem that we will have during an election campaign will be a tissue of lies from the EU trying to scare people into voting for the status quo. They will be quite ruthless in that.
Guest 714- Registered: 14 Apr 2011
- Posts: 2,594
The problem with taxpayer funding is twofold
a) if it is allocated on previous votes the larger parties are massively favoured
b) how would a new party such as Green or UKIP establish?
That's apart from the fact we're skint and have better things to do with the money
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
let's be honest barry, both sides will come out with headline grabbing nonsense to get their point across, but as i said earlier by 2017 the whole make up of the european union could have changed markedly in that it could actually revert to a single market as was the original intention (or so we were told). if that happens then a referendum would probably come out with a "stay in" decision.
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
If it was just the original concept of a market then I would vote for it....... But I do mean only a market....
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
if germany wants change then it will happen especially with backing from france.
very few member states are happy with laws passed over them by bureaucrats from afar unless they are nett recipients of course.
Guest 683- Registered: 11 Feb 2009
- Posts: 1,052
Barry, I stand by what I said. If you won't re-read it that is your prerogative.
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
This thread is going all over the place,
But lets reply to some
The mouse knows he isn't going to win the election so could promise anything
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Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
you have two hopes on a referendum no hope and bob hope,the latter is brown bread.
and besides that what ever government is in will not hold one,they keep moving the goal posts and welch on it all.
Guest 725- Registered: 7 Oct 2011
- Posts: 1,418
There are very few people who can see the "complete picture". Among those who can are figures such as Richard North whose sterling work can be read on his website:
http://www.eureferendum.com/
Take virtually every issue in the news agenda concerning domestic politics in this country and you find that it's a pound to a penny that the evil hand of Brussels is rocking the cradle from energy policy to food.
Hmmm food. Here's a thing.
Perusing the net I stumbled across this gem:
http://livewellforlife.eu/
I mean a low carbon diet??? Really? Well I guess it makes a change from low carb or high additive which is peronal favourite.
Then I thought to myself where will this end? Again google is our friend despite their tax position.
http://ec.europa.eu/environment/life/ It goes on forever nes pas? Scroll down and down and down.
Just who is paying for this bilge and how much is it all costing?
"Since 1992, LIFE has co-financed some 3708 projects, contributing approximately €2.8 billion to the protection of the environment."
That's just one small aspect of the EU scam. While poor people have to decide whether to eat or heat the hippies are doing their thing on planet Utopia.
Beam me up Scotty.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
Philip,for the last time,there will not be a referendum ever.its all lip service to keep you eurosceptics quite.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Quite right, Brian: it's pointless even getting involved on any EU referendum campaign.
There will be no EU referendum, the EU will just fall apart.
How, is anyone's guess.
Perhaps we should wait and see if Hague manages to fuel the Syria war into some gigantic conflagration.
After all it could bring in millions (of people).
That would get GDP growing and give developers plenty to do.
There could be jobs cutting down woods and bulldozing up farms,which will bring in more millions.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
all speculation alex.