Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,983
Yes I went there last week with my sons girl friend by car .I doubt if i will ever venture there on a bus as its a long walk from Tesco bus stop.I find a trip to Homebase is bad enough .You cant just go there for a brouse ,when B/Q was at charlton green you could do that .
My family went to Hythe yesterday still a few small shops trading there and a Waitrose in town .
Waitrose is about the only one I can stomach - it at least tries to be ethical and always offers quality and doesn't have screens shouting at you down the aisles. If I have to shop in a super (?) market at least I can enjoy the experience at Waitrose! (And the wines are universally great). And yes Sue, it is not a pleasure to browse if you have to drive/bus it there. I used to enjoy a rummage in B&Q and often found the odd purchase - I won't be doing that up at the wastelands.
It's all good and well spitting out comments which utterly condemn large corporations as being "evil" and "satanic" or claiming that we are all being somehow brainwashed by expensive advertising but everyone is missing one very important fact in this whole matter. The "shopper" is not as dumb as the anti-advertising people would like to think, and certainly not as much a victim as the "big shops are evil" people would have us believe. The opposite is true. The "shopper" is generally quite savvy these days, being highly empowered with their choices thanks to the accessibility of online resources and the aggressive competition afforded by those evil large companies.
Just to use an obscure example, I used to have to travel to Dean Street in London to find exotic and rare records (obviously long before the Internet, and even just at the dawn of CD music). But these days I can travel to any number of big HMV stores, or check out Amazon, Ebay, Play.com, or whatever, and find those same albums in seconds, all priced in such a way that I have genuine, meaningful choices to make based on price, quality, speed of delivery, and so on. "Shopping around" is no longer confined to what the two local shops can offer, it now means we can check out vast global resources if we want to. If we don't mind waiting then we order online - if we want it today then we nip to a suitable store.
I do think that for high streets (as we know them) to survive into the new era they are going to have to embrace the New Shopper's demanding savvy. They will have to innovate, adopt imaginative business practices, and of course this will include some form of help from authorities and business leaders. Small local high street shops are a decaying force and becoming ever more rare.
Keith - I don't say that seeing local high streets going to rot is "progress" but the shopping habits of people and the way the shopping landscape is changing IS progressive, regardless of how this sits with your social or political views. You are still saying this decay is the fault of some major evil force (perhaps the big companies), but I still believe that it is US, the SHOPPERS, who cause these damaging effects because our needs / wants / expectations have changed so much and the high street hasn't kept up.
And as for the "materialistic" argument - oh please!!! We're all consumers, we all like to own nice things, and we all like to spend a bit from time to time. Don't we?
I think you will find I was being sarcastic, Rick. Keep up.
What you say is true, we all like Stuff, but there are other things as well, and the focus on Stuff and the acquisition of Stuff is repugnant. There are people starving and we have Tesco shoving screens up our ar*es in the aisles telling us to Buy More, Get More, Have More: It's cheap and lovely and you need it. Well, we don't. It's nice, and it's pleasant to have stuff, but when all is said and done the World has enough to feed and clothe everyone and some, but we squander it carelessly and thoughtlessly. The consumer IS as stupid as we think - just look around. I include myself in that.
DT1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 15 Apr 2008
- Posts: 1,116
I think we all joke about large corporations being evil, just by the very basis of their vast expansion being based on greed. However we do have to appreciate the size of many of them and fully understand that they are not there to aid us, as they would have us believe. "Everyday low prices" or "every little helps" are actually just products of consumerist advertising, they actually have very little truth behind the pretence. This isn't about 'the shopper' being dumb, it's actually just about them being bombarded with information that is more to do with 'how to' rather than 'why to'. This bombardment can only be used by those people/companies that already have, and this is why we should be cautious, although not fanatical!
The media we are presented with almost all has an agenda, chosen by just a few, consumerism is used as a way of forgetting about real issues. 'Retail-therapy' is very real and it is amazing how the purchase of something meaningless and mostly ephemeral, can mask real issues. This is the underlying principle of why people are prepared to get themselves into debt for a widescreen TV or new laptop, when their kids could actually benefit from some plain old fashioned attention. Widescreens, and many other materialistic items, fall into the 'stuff' category and I love it too. However every time I see a kid getting a hard time over the fact his trainers are not branded I find it hard to believe that large corporations don't have an 'evil' element. What do I do as a parent? I buy the brand, so my child fits the normality that is set by the corporation/brand, even if I can't afford it. Choice is what you think you have but actually this is largely defined by the big boys. Thankfully both my children still wear unbranded plimsolls at the moment...as do me and my wife.
The Supermarkets are the same, 'rolling back the prices' we are told, presenting us with a nonsensical graph of some kind comparing their prices to other 'high street stores' 95% of these shops listed don't even exist on the high street. If you compare their prices to the 'real' high street you realise they're seriously ripping you off, and all the time you are buying online you will never know! 'Oh it's about the convenience' I am told and that I totally understand! But you have more time to do what? Sit at home and stay out of the way of other people? Tesco is the most awful place for interaction and I honestly believe people take their kids there just to shout at them! The experience is a chore, shopping in a town can be an event, we should remember this!
Now whether I like this or not is irrelevant, this is change/progress and this is defined by the actions of society (or a group of individuals, if that's how you like it) and Rick is right in saying the high street has failed to keep up with our wants, although how much of these are actually 'ours' is another matter. It actually does provide perfectly well for our needs already. It is also true on the face of things that globalised consumerism has increased our choice, but actually when we bury down into what is on offer the choice has always been there and we are just being sold another 'lifestyle' in this case convenience. If we think about the richness of the experience offered by travelling to London to buy some music, not only at a personal level but to a more widespread economy/community I'm not sure we can just measure everything in terms of money. The music idea also provides another good analogy for the problems of relying on the 'big boys'. Much of the obscure music is being accessed by a larger group, which is good. However I know from my own collection (most of which I have bought online) that many of these artists would not even have published music if it were not for small independent labels. It is not the Warners or Sonys that provide us with obscure pieces of delight because they do not see them as viable, and if it were to them I think I would stop listening to music, you don't think the Spice Girls were big because they were good?! In the same way towns can offer obscure and unique delight (as Wil Alsop is more than aware) But we are not reminded of this, because towns don't have the advertising clout or cash and are not promoted.
We are not that savvy and actually buy into so much that is not essential, just nice...god knows I have bought smoothy makers, foot-spas and health grills. I know why as well: because I have been sucked in, thankfully not too far and not to my financial detriment. It's the people at the top pedalling this idea of 'choice' forcing the consumers at the bottom slowly into tertiary employment to sustain the presented lifestyles(Tesco already employ more people than the British army and have £1 in every £10 spent in their stores). Choice is their control not ours, as politics is just as much defined by the media as by us.
Guest 656- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,262
I had a nice shopping day in Dover on saturday, after visiting our local Regatta Hairdressing Salon at the Churchill with my girls, I went rummaging around in De Bradelei Wharf as one does, then on to Somerfields to shop where I met and chatted with Carol Webb, then the Card Factory where I bumped into Una Mills, popped into W H Smiths as Sue did above and on to M & S and Boots etc. I love the local shopping experience in Dovertown, long may it live
Popped up to the new B & Q, what a cold shopping experience that was, at least when they were based in Charlton Green you could also shop for your Pets and a few bargains elsewhere. Its location, in a field in the middle of nowhere, is for lots of people difficult to get to, not to mention it distinct lack of 'cachet'
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
that is exactly how it should be colette!!!
meeting people you know when you are out, that is what i love about going into our town.
i always meet or see someone i know, sometimes we go for a coffee or a beer, sometimes just a short chat.
sadly we cannot get all that we need in our town, but still better than the soulless out of town shopping experience.