Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
I don't think even the most ardent Brexiteer actually believes that "they need us more than we need them" as they simply don't. What's new about this article is that somebody has actually come out and said it!
On the related point, I don't agree that the BBC is leave or remain or that Sky has suddenly become remain. Rather, it appears it is about the individual. John Humphrys and Andrew Neil (BBC) are clearly leave, whereas, Gary Lineker (BBC) and Faisal Islam (Sky) are remain.
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John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
[QUOTE="ray hutstone"]A market of 500m+ doesn't need a market of 60m+ as much as a market of 60m+ needs a market of 500m+. Tricky one that, John, isn't it?
Not tricky at all Ray. Admittedly, Europe collectively are obviously bigger than us, but individual European countries would also take a hit surely if for any reason trade between us went pear shaped.
Or are you saying that the fact we import more from the EU than we export to them is irrelevant and inconsequential?
If we can be sensible about things we need each other of course, but at least for any future shortfall in our export trade we will have the option of sourcing other markets elsewhere.
The EU isn’t the only market in the world and is possibly a declining one at that!
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
The only reason I look at the Sky News site is to see if Faisal Islam is covering a subject, probably the most astute journalist around and researches issues thoroughly.
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
He is great, isn't he? Yes, I am remain and so is he - but absolutely, he does his research and knows his stuff. Indeed, Brexit has quite literally sorted the wheat from the chaff - the old guard, like John Humphrys, do look way out of their depth and very lazy all of a sudden.
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Button- Location: Dover
- Registered: 22 Jul 2016
- Posts: 2,907
I think the best TV article on Dover that I've watched was done a while back by Channel 4's Siobhan Kennedy - concise and well-written and she obviously has her contacts. But I suppose journos have to fill space, so last week she wrote that "HM customs" (sic) might suspend checks to avoid chaos - which is hardly news given that HMRC's Chief Executive said the same to the Treasury Select Committee ages ago.
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(Not my real name.)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
#2304 - I suspect you're wasting your breath, Howard. Or at least your keyboard.
John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
ray hutstone wrote:#2304 - I suspect you're wasting your breath, Howard. Or at least your keyboard.
That might be correct Ray if Brexit was purely and simply about trade and the economy, but it’s not, is it?
Something that that some of the resident dullards on here can’t quite comprehend unfortunately.
Still, live and let live eh?
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
never mind john keep taking the pills, they will kick in soon. you haven't got much longer to wait.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
I take a much broader view of politics than Ray or John who dismiss or don't even read stuff from sources that they don't like. Maybe I have too much time on my hands but I read the Independent first thing for genuine news as they do what it says on the tin other than the EU issue.
I subscribe to the Times, Telegraph and Guardian for well written articles, some I agree with some I don't but feel that I cannot form a firm view on a subject unless I have read conflicting ideas. When in the mood for lighter stuff the Mail and Express do the trick, the former leads either with family of 15 on benefits to be derided or the socialite offsprings of billionaires that pose with their sports cars, private planes and speedboats with vacuous grins on their faces, and with not hint of irony they are celebrated.
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John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
I actually hope Brian that we do have a second vote a bit further down the line. The result of which will hopefully shut up the whinging media commentators, politicos, celebs and luvvies and those reliant on EU funding etc., once and for all.
People in fact that have assured, by their actions, that we either don’t get a “deal” other than a crap one!
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
I wonder if you'll be saying that if the result doesn't go in your direction. Or are you amongst those who predict fighting in the streets and mass insurrection? The "yes or no" referendum on Europe was never an accurate reflection of the complexity of the situation. People are looking into the box labelled "brexit" and finding that it contains something rather brown and malodorous.
If you really believe in democracy you won't object to a final vote based upon full knowledge of the facts.
Pierre Morgune- Registered: 9 Mar 2014
- Posts: 100
John Buckley wrote:That might be correct Ray if Brexit was purely and simply about trade and the economy, but it’s not, is it?
Something that that some of the resident dullards on here can’t quite comprehend unfortunately.
Still, live and let live eh?
Brian Dixon wrote:never mind john keep taking the pills, they will kick in soon. you haven't got much longer to wait.
ray hutstone wrote:I wonder if you'll be saying that if the result doesn't go in your direction. Or are you amongst those who predict fighting in the streets and mass insurrection? The "yes or no" referendum on Europe was never an accurate reflection of the complexity of the situation. People are looking into the box labelled "brexit" and finding that it contains something rather brown and malodorous.
If you really believe in democracy you won't object to a final vote based upon full knowledge of the facts.
Enfants! Mes Enfants!!!
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John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
ray hutstone wrote:I wonder if you'll be saying that if the result doesn't go in your direction. Or are you amongst those who predict fighting in the streets and mass insurrection? The "yes or no" referendum on Europe was never an accurate reflection of the complexity of the situation. People are looking into the box labelled "brexit" and finding that it contains something rather brown and malodorous.
If you really believe in democracy you won't object to a final vote based upon full knowledge of the facts.
Quite right Ray, I don’t object at all to a final vote as long as both sides have an equal and fair chance to put their side across. No problem with that whatsoever. However, there may well be fighting in the streets etc., as you put it, if it’s perceived to be one sided with cheating involved, but hopefully that wouldn’t be the case.
From a personal perspective though, whilst I love my country, the result probably wouldn’t affect me too much one way or the other as I doubt whether I’ll be living here that much longer.
John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
Less of the “old” thank you Pierre!
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
#2312 - We have that in common at least, John. I sincerely hope that you remain well enough to continue the debates for the longest time.
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John Buckley- Registered: 6 Oct 2013
- Posts: 615
Hope I didn’t mislead you Ray, I meant moving to another country, not dying! ( just in case we got our wires crossed? )
ray hutstone- Registered: 1 Apr 2018
- Posts: 2,158
Thank the Lord for that!
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Weird Granny Slater- Location: Dover
- Registered: 7 Jun 2017
- Posts: 2,849
John Buckley wrote:...if Brexit was purely and simply about trade and the economy, but it’s not, is it?
As they say on social media, This.
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'Pass the cow dung, my dropsy's killing me' - Heraclitus
Neil Moors- Registered: 3 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,232
This is true. You all know I am a remainer, but I am happy to recognise that Brexit wasn't about the economy.
This is why I would still advocate leaving the single market, but not the customs union as a least worst option. Doing so sorts out the Irish (and other) border issue and still hits the target on free movement of people - which was the biggest concern of the referendum. The public couldn't give a stuff about trade deals, they just don't care.