8 December 2009
12:3734587Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
8 December 2009
13:4634589It`ll take the Antarctic ice shelf to collapse to convince most.
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Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
8 December 2009
14:0334592As I understand it, one of the effects of global warming will be to melt the ice sheets and glaciers pouring an awful lot of cold water into the oceans. Quite apart from sea-level rises this will have the effect of stopping the Atlantic conveyer (Gulf Stream) dead in its tracks. As it is the Atlantic conveyor which keeps our island warmer than it's latitude would otherwise suggest the result will be a cooling of our northern weather patterns and, possibly, the re-creation of the polar ice sheets, more heat reflected back into space and more cooling resulting in the start of the next ice age!
A couple of links to back up what Rick was saying:
Yellowstone Volcano -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/blog/2009/jan/06/supervolcano-volcano-yellowstone-earthquake
Mega Tsunami -
http://www.armageddononline.org/dc-tusnami.html
Both have contributions from Prof. Bill (Disaster Man) McGuire, a gentleman I know and greatly respect his opinions.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
8 December 2009
14:2634593Apart from all that unnecessary noisy music, that was a good Horizon episode Phil. And as you say, Professor Bill Maguire is a very interesting gentleman. I still have it taped from BBC2 on 12 October 2000. Also some others he appeared in.
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Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
8 December 2009
14:3334594The Gulf Stream would not be stopped, just moved, increasing the warming effect on Southern Europe and North Africa. Yellowstone, next week or 10,000 years away. The Canaries, next week or 2-3,000 years away. Comets are always around in much the same way as cars and buses.
Nobody (except maybe a few extremists) is saying stop industralisation just that the methods and practices need to change. Pollution does kill now so better systems and safeguards are needed now and if improving things helps to slow or adjust climatic changes (whatever is causing them) so much the better.
People can change, if not we would still be sitting around coal fires and filling our baths from the outside pump, all that is being asked is that the timescale for changed be moved up a notch. Why is that so scary to those not invested in fossil fuels?
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
8 December 2009
15:2234595All of you out there have insurances on your house, car and many other things I`m sure. Ships, aircraft and the like all have to have insurance, it`s the law. Yet, living on this planet, we have no insurance at all, as I mentioned in one of my previous threads. This planet owes nobody a living, and evolution and natural selection does not care whether we survive or not. It doesn`t work that way. Survival of the fittest, but a real catostrophe wouldn`t protect you no matter how fit you are. My reasons for getting out of our nursery, and setting up home in some Lunar or Martian real estate as somewhere`s else to go. Expensive? Yes. But what`s money when you may perish anyway. Sorry, I`ve drifted a few million miles from original thread, but still revellent I think.
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Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,706
8 December 2009
20:3734611I think we need to make some clear distinctions here.
Pollution is fundamentally wrong, the production of toxic wastes cannot be condoned, however the vast majority of C02 produced is from things like domestic heating and cooking rather than industrial processes. As for methane the vast majority of this comes from ruminant animals and rotting vegetation.
Of course we need to think about our industrial processes and find ways to eliminate waste, reduce or eliminate toxic outputs, produce things that can be effectively and efficiently recycled and find ways to minimise the energy and wate. usage of domesticity.
However, we equally need to recognise that the almost messianic fervour of the green/climate change lobby is not actually in anyone's long term interest as it is
a) hypocritical - do they avoid flying? are they all vegetarian/vegan? do they only use public transport?
b) unreasonably restrictive on growth
c) inequitable to Africa, India and South America
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
8 December 2009
20:5034612Some good points there Ross. I've long thought that the Greens were wasting their breath.
The human race has really only had an effect on the atmosphere in a relatively short time span - since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution. Natural phenomena produces far more CO2 than humankind does!
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
9 December 2009
07:4434624Well duh! But then that's a bit like saying mercury is poisonous but as it's natural it's ok to encourage people to drink it. Natural toxins are there for a reason and meet a natural need - it is the excesses we provide that cause the problems!
Guest 686- Registered: 5 May 2009
- Posts: 556
9 December 2009
13:0034638I can't disagree with that Bern, though my point was aimed more towards greenhouse gases such as CO2 and CH4 rather than the pollutants that have little to do with adding to global warming.
Phil West
If at first you don't succeed, use a BIGGER hammer!!
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
9 December 2009
16:1534645Nature always copes, and has done in the past, even in the most extreme conditions, (snowball Earth, comets etc). We`re nearing a point as to see whether nature can cope with us.
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