howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
got talking to this chap on saturday up near the grand shaft.
name of john pegg he is the leading light behind the proposed memorial and explained to me the current situation.
i commented that i thought that things had gone on the back burner, apparently not still being worked on behind the scenes.
it seems that once the olympics are over a lot more money will be washing around the heritage lottery fund and john and his organisation are quietly confident of getting the necessary finance.
beside the obvious kudos of having the memorial here, the financial benefits to dover were incredibly high, have to wih him luck in his venture.
Guest 663- Registered: 20 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,136
Agree with you there howard, good luck to the chap and his organisation.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I posted on here about the National War Memorial a few days ago - it would indeed be the fillip Dover needs and would increase tourism to levels never seen here.
A wonderful place for a pilgrimage too.
I wish John well, but he must be getting very nervous about the time between now and 2014.
Did he say about the view of EH Howard ? were they now onside ?
Roger
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
he is chipping away roger, not totally onside yet as far as i understand.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I really hope they come on board very soon, or it will be lost. I don't really know their objection.
If Sandy Bruce-Lockart was still in charge of English Heritage, it would have been approved and work started.
Roger
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Let's just thrown it in here......thought about posting and decided not to.... but her goes...
Apparently the view of the Inspector of Monuments is that the Western Heights are not appropriate to WW1..... for those at the open weekend you would have seen the new panel that Phil created of the Band of the Kings Own Lancaster Regiment that were stationed at the Grand Shaft Barracks and photographed in the Drop Redoubt. This photo was taken in July 1914... just a month later the band was more or less wiped out during the War on the continent and never reformed. How appropriate to WW1 is that ?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
Been nice knowing you :)
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
I doubt if you could get more appropriate
So many soldiers must have departed from this area never to return, our white cliffs would have been the last they ever saw of the British Isles.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
So, does the Inspector of Ancient Monuments know about the Kings Own Lancaster Regiment and what happened to them in 1914.
Does he, as Jan has said, know that thousands of soldiers left England from here, never to return ?
I'm sure John Pegg has put every argument he can think of.
Roger
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
This is a brilliant project that is actively supported by the Chamber of Commerce. I believe that David Foley was up at the Heigths with John Pegg during the weekend.
Clearly the Inspector of Ancient Monuments needs educating in our history...
Guest 675- Registered: 30 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,610
There was the suggestion from English Heritage that Folkestone could be more appropriate (remember the wartime hit "I'm looking over the white cliffs of Folkestone"). Improvements to Memorial Road are planned, there is nothing more iconic than a steep hill as far as they are concerned. Portsmouth are also said to be looking into such a memorial.
EH are said to now be looking favourably on DDC's dream of a hotel on the Western Heights. As the 100th anniversary of WW1 is fast approaching someone ought to point out the advantages of the proposed memorial on the Western Heights for the town, the country(in terms of having a source of national pride) and in attracting investors to back a hotel by having a visitor destination there.
Politics, it seems to me, for years, or all too long, has been concerned with right or left instead of right or wrong.
Richard Armour
Guest 644- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,214
Seems a shame that appears to be the decision. Need I mention the Dover Patrol, the losses of which are commemmorated on the obelisk at St. Margarets? Or the Zeebrugge Raid in which 227 men were killed? Dover was the departure point for many of the poor men who were slaughtered in the trenches, at Gallipoli and elsewhere.
On July 23th 1914 the 1st Battalion of the King's Own Royal Lancaster Regiment comprising of exactly 1000 men were shipped to Boulogne from the Grand Shaft Barracks where they had been billeted for the previous 18 months. Just three days later they were ambushed at 6am in an open cornfield by German machine gunners near Le Cateau. They suffered 400 casualties, i.e. 40% of the entire battalion in just two minutes. Very relevant to Dover.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Not sure if we should really say to much on the matter what with our involvement with English Heritage so we need to be careful...
However, I think a lot of the arguements are a smoke screen covering that they don't want anything on the Heights that would take away visitors from Dover Castle. A sad view I know as they can only complement each other and make Dover a weekend venue rather than just a day trip to the Castle.....
Been nice knowing you :)
Guest 644- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 1,214
For the record, just speaking personally, not as a WHPS volunteer.
Parking could be an issue though. Could Dover accommodate the projected figures?
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Me too (note to the newspapers as they seem to pick up 1/2 their content from here these days!!)
Park and Ride would be the way to go if thing really pick up, I know the council have mooted this idea before....
Been nice knowing you :)
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,894
I agree Paul, I would have thought that those that visit the castle would visit the memorial and visa versa. I fail to understand English Heritage on this unless they have another site that would be of more benefit to them somewhere else in the country.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
It might make a park and ride viable.
A quality conference hotel on the Western Heights combined to making a feature of the Grand Shaft and the War memorial - plus the chair lift to the castle, all integrated would benefit the town and EH.
It is such a pity that EH see themselves as something apart and play no role in the community, it is a real disgrace to be frank, correction, they are a disgrace. If public bodies like them wont play a proper part how on earth can businesses be expected to. Thankfully many local businesses are far more public spirited than EH.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Agreed Barry (apart from any dreaded cablecar ideas
)
Been nice knowing you :)
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
i would like to see the war memorial on the western hieghts,but allso like to see the drop redoubt/grand shaft open as well.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
Yes Brian that would be the ideal situation..
PERSONALLY, my view is:
Hotel & Conference Centre to bring a permanent presence into the area
Grand Shaft Barracks as the memorial site
Grand Shaft permanently opened
Drop Redoubt as a museum, cafe, visitor centre
It is all about compromise and I don't think anyone will come along with the £millions that are needed, and I don't think any of these elements can really happen in isolation
Been nice knowing you :)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
surely the shaft and drop redoubt would automatically open full time with the war memorial there.
just plain and simple business sense.
well thought out stuff from paul there whether it comes to fruition is another thing.
