Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
In Germany cyclists are told to ride on the pavements if the pavements were wider ones in Dover I think it would be OK and we had cyclists that toke care when doing so .
Terry Nunn
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,316
Walking down the High Street on the pavement where it narrows by the High Street Surgery, my wife was slightly knocked sideways by a "yoof" at high speed on a bike. Passing the entrance to the Charlton Centre we met two Civil Enforcement Officers. I could see that the cyclist passed them. When I mentioned the incident to them the male version just looked bewildered. It was obviously such a common occurrence that he didn't notice. The female version said "Sorry, we have no powers for that".
Well, it's about time they bloody well did!
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
I'm sure they do have the powers Terry - they just don't exercise them.
Either it's illegal to ride on the pavement, or it isn't and I don't think it is.
Roger
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,883
Terry, those "yoofs" that cycles towards town are a real pain in the rear end, they charge along the pavement with scant regard for pedestrians, I often saw them when I was at the shop.
They are just using the pavement as a short cut rather than use the longer one way system or cycle path by Morrisons, it has nothing to do with their safety just their bad practice.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 744- Registered: 20 Mar 2012
- Posts: 412
Tom I think I need to lie down. First post of yours I have understood and totally agree with. Maybe your "Tomology" (as Pauline describes it) has been cured.
Guest 683- Registered: 11 Feb 2009
- Posts: 1,052
As I read it it is illegal to ride on pavements "beside roads" (so you can on those through alleyways and parks etc)
"Penalty on persons committing nuisances by riding on footpaths, &c.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . F1 If any person shall wilfully ride upon any footpath or causeway by the side of any road made or set apart for the use or accommodation of foot passengers; or shall wilfully lead or drive any horse, ass, sheep, mule, swine, or cattle or carriage of any description, or any truck or sledge, upon any such footpath or causeway; or shall tether any horse, ass, mule, swine, or cattle, on any highway, so as to suffer or permit the tethered animal to be thereon;. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . F2; every person so offending in any of the cases aforesaid shall for each and every such offence forfeit and pay any sum not exceeding [F3level 2 on the standard scale], over and above the damages occasioned thereby".
(Highways Act 1835 Sect 72)
I also understand it is one of the few offences which Police AND PCSOs can give fines for.
The discussion should be about proper provision for pedestrians and cyclist rather than being forced to share very limited space. Putting red tarmac or the occasional white line on a road does not make safe provision or encourage people to take to their bicycles. Where we have two lane, one-way, traffic we should reduce one lane to cars and the other to buses and bikes. That would discourage car use, as it would become a slow business, and entice people to take up cycling or use faster public transport.
Unfortunately the car is king and this will not happen all the time we give it supremacy.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Yes it is, Roger.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Bob Whysman
- Registered: 23 Aug 2013
- Posts: 1,938
Jan Higgins wrote:I have no objection to sensible and considerate cyclists using the pavement but I do object to those who thinks every pedestrian should get out of their way especially when it means a pedestrian is nearly pushed into the road.
Most British pavements are narrow and built for pedestrians not cyclists, mothers with prams or young children, dog walkers and us oldies can not just jump out of their way.
Well put young JanH, they should also consider not so young ladies with a shopping trolley and help them on and off buses, not use them as targets for their perverted pleasure.
Cycles should also have mandatory insurance and a clear identification mark to enable them to be more easily traceable.
Do nothing and nothing happens.
Terry Nunn- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,316
Given the comments above I've asked DDC to tell me exactly what powers the CEO's have.
I await an answer.
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Guest 767- Registered: 30 Aug 2012
- Posts: 458
Bikes belong on the road - end of! Do they need a bell, or lights? they used to, Bikes on the pavements are just as wrong as my walking along the white line in the middle of the rd!
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
#30
On those points Phil.
Cycling is now a thing taken to an extreme of efficiency. Any old thing does not do these days, thousands of pounds are spent to get the latest thing in power to weight ratio.
A growing problem is the 'stealth-cyclist', noiselessly, semi-professionally, haring about in an ever easier effort to undercut the journey time of the car they have traded-in.
Add to this their 'need', either to be plugged-in to the phone or music player. No longer simply blind to the Highway Code, but now deaf also to the world of the pedestrian around them.
I have cycled around London, commuting to and from work, using back streets and major thoroughfares and I know that it does not pay to be timid amongst motorised traffic, but we all need to heed the old maxim;Sail before steam, and defer to the slowest road user, the pedestrian.
(Don't get me started on those who cycle through public parks...grrrr!)
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
Going Dutch? Berkshire site tests Netherlands cycling model
Experiments gauge how British pedestrians and motorists react to pioneering Dutch-style bike infrastructure
"It is a sunny morning in the Berkshire woodland and a small group of men and women clutching clipboards are lurking behind trees or amid the ferns, looking alert and expectant. Then the object of their attention comes into view: not a shy songbird or a rare mammal, but a cyclist clad in a fluorescent bib.
Followed closely by a small car, the rider stops by traffic lights at a road junction set somewhat incongruously amid the trees. Another bike-and-car duo rolls into view at the other side. The various lights turn green, and everyone heads cautiously on their way.
This is the test ground of the Transport Research Laboratory (TRL) near Bracknell, and the closely watched traffic flows are part of a pioneering project that could fundamentally change Britain's inner cities over the next few decades.
TRL, formerly part of the Department for Transport but now a world-leading independent research group, is conducting a £4m test programme for Transport for London (TfL) to see how Dutch-style cycling infrastructure, such as segregated lanes and cyclist-priority roundabouts, can be adapted to British road conditions.
Work has already begun to reshape some London roads and junctions, part of a grandiose £900m plan unveiled by Boris Johnson earlier this year. Campaigners hope other areas could follow suit, tilting life in urban Britain away from decades of car dominance..."
http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/aug/26/going-dutch-berkshire-tests-netherlands-cycling Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Terry Nunn- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,316
I refer to my postings 22 & 29.
I have received a reply as follows from a Corporate Support Officer:-
Dear Mr Nunn
Thank you for your request for information about civil enforcement officers. Your request was received on 23 August 2013 and I am dealing with it under the terms of the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
In some circumstances a fee may be payable and if that is the case, I will let you know. A fees notice will be issued to you, and you will be required to pay before we will proceed to deal with your request.
If you have any queries about this email, please contact me.
Additional guidance on requests for information made under the Freedom of Information Act can be found on the Council's website: http://dover.gov.uk/council__democracy/freedom_of_information.aspx
Is it really so secret that an F.O.I. request needs to be made?
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
does seem to take the request rather seriously, when i asked them to give me figures on money spent on tram shelter repairs a year or so back i received a letter giving the answer a few days later.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
It appears that CEOs are there to regulate traffic only...
6. Consistency and Proportionality
All Civil Enforcement Officers are trained to the same standards, by way of an in-house manual, formal training and on-going monitoring.
Civil Enforcement Officers cannot retract a Penalty Charge Notice once it has been lawfully issued.
http://www.dover.gov.uk/Transport,-Streets--Parking/Parking/Documents--Policies/Enforcement-Policy.aspxIgnorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Terry Nunn- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,316
Got home to find a second email from DDC. It directed me to this
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2004/18/contents
I've had a hard day and I'll look at it tomorrow. However, I wonder why they didn't suggest their own document that Tom found.
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
I saw that page earlier, under 'Enforcement Officers' it has this...
"76Civil enforcement officers
(1)A local authority may provide for the enforcement of road traffic contraventions for which it is the enforcement authority by individuals to be known as civil enforcement officers.
(2)A civil enforcement officer must be—
(a)an individual employed by the authority, or
(b)where the authority have made arrangements with any person for the purposes of this section, an individual employed by that person to act as a civil enforcement officer.
(3)Civil enforcement officers—
(a)when exercising specified functions must wear such uniform as may be determined by the enforcement authority in accordance with guidelines issued by the appropriate national authority, and
(b)must not exercise any of those functions when not in uniform.
(4)In subsection (3)(a) "specified" means specified by regulations made by the appropriate national authority.
(5)A parking attendant appointed under section 63A of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27) by a local authority that is an enforcement authority—
(a)is a civil enforcement officer in relation to parking contraventions for which that authority is the enforcement authority, and
(b)may be appointed a civil enforcement officer in relation to other road traffic contraventions for which they are the enforcement authority. "
All of which still leaves us to wonder who the 'appropriate national authority' might be.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.