Terry Nunn
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,321
3 September 2009
18:2728448#1
As an old age pensioner (and a miserable one at that!) I always need to spend my money wisely and carefully. I have been considering shelling out the 55 quid necessary to try out the Javelin trains on HS1.
I must admit that ever since I heard about their introduction I was very sceptical about them. I remember saying on the old forum that they would only be introduced to the detriment of the Charing Cross and Victoria services. I was at least proved right in that respect. Both the traditional routes will be virtually "all stations" and will take far longer than now.
It's horses for courses of course but I would fall into the category of not wanting to get to St Pancras in double quick time only to spend another half hour being jostled on a sweaty tube train to get into central London.
I am old enough to remember the luxurious seating on the old SUB's and EPB's and was not really enamoured when the CEP's were refurbished with "harder" seating. All of this pales into insignificance when you look at the budget airline single class type seating on the Javelins.
Another nail in the coffin to put me off, and something that seems to have been kept quiet about, is the fact that these 140mph trains won't actually travel that fast. Unless they have to make up time they will be restricted to 125mph. HST's were doing that 40 years ago!
So, to sum up. I think I'll give it a miss and invest in another tank of petrol.
BTW ASDA are still selling it at 102.9!
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
3 September 2009
19:2328450#2
Ta Terry!!!!
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
3 September 2009
19:4828455#3
Ah good post Terry. The trains are scheduled soon and I suppose will revolutionise in a way travel to London. Two things though..as Terry said the old service will go to hell and the new one will be expensive. Another thing...Do you remember the much heralded talk on the explosion in house/flat prices that was supposed to happen due to us slipping/powering into the commuter belt with HST. Cant really see it myself. Cant see the yuppie set trudging all the way to dear old Dover for their daily commute...I mean ..its not cool!
4 September 2009
08:3328477#4
Dear Terry
Fully agree with you.
With a journey time of 65 to 70 minutes to St Pancras then to get to Central London/West End another 25 to 30 minutes negates the speed.
As already posted by me on the open site we shall have one High Speed serviceand one "all stations" ordinary train to Charing Cross taking 2 hours- I see no progress with this.
I have mentioned to Councillors that to attract commuters a service under 60 minutes is required.
With the high fares (£55 return) then National Express will benefit and there comes another problem of congestion in Pencester ???
Guest 660- Registered: 14 Mar 2008
- Posts: 3,205
4 September 2009
09:3028481#5
As you know I have to be careful what I say because of working for Southeastern,on the bright side we are starting to see a few people moving down here to take advantage of the lower house prices and because of HS1.The fare is £55 on the preview service to London because of the times it goes,you have to remember that the fare at that time of the morning Day Return is £47,and if you want to include the Underground £51.50.
We are getting quite a few enquires about the train which starts on Monday at 06.40 but if you have a ticket going past London to the North or East or even West then when the new full service starts will be either no extra cost or £4 odd which is about the same as the Underground and a lot less than a taxi.From St Pancras you can get to the Midlands as well as places like Liverpool and with Kings X and Euston just down the road and within walking distance it is quite a good hub for connections.
But I will be the first to admit it is probably the wrong places for the majority of workers in London,my main concern is that I at the moment can't travel on it as staff are barred until the full service comes in and we are still waiting to hear if we will be allowed.
I have been on the train as all staff were shown the train and it is impessive being in the cab at 140mph,as all signalling is done on the train,and there is no real reason for the driver to look out of the window except arriving or departing from Stations.
This is new and some people are really excited about it and many will travel on it,so lets not knock it,but....how will it affect the current timetable when it changes in December.
If you knew what I know,we would both be in trouble!
Terry Nunn- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,321
5 September 2009
08:2928517#6
I did say that it was horses for courses John. There is no doubt that for those traveling to the midlands and the north the Javelins are an excellent starting point, I just can't see how useful they would be for commuters.
Anyway, to go slightly off subject, good luck tonight. As you know I would would have liked to have been there but but I shall be on a very different train.
Terry
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Guest 673- Registered: 16 Jun 2008
- Posts: 1,388
11 September 2009
03:3928753#7
I would echo everything said above but we should nevertheless unreservedly welcome a high speed service which finally restores a respectable connection time to London from Dover. It will be interesting to see if it brings the anticipated regeneration bonus. I was actually in the process of writing a learned epistle on how this is very much a political animal when my wretched computer shut down for automatic windows updates at 0300. Might return to the subject at a later date but my scratcher calls!
In the meantime, I would like to congratulate Nigel Collor for his great success in bringing these trains to Dover. I know how much Keith hates having Nigel credited with this but he was the face and the driving force behind the campaign and that is what you need. If one has to credit a long list of all the others involved every time one broaches the subject, it begins to get like those endless dedications on the radio where somebody wants to list everybody from their old maiden aunt to the bloke who fixed their bathroom tap.
However, so as not to offend Keith I would also like to thank the following just this once, in no particular order:
Keith Sansum, Nigel Collor, Gwyn Prosser, Keith Sansum, Dr Steve Ladyman, Margaret Thatcher, John Prescott, Keith Sansum, all at No.53 Acacia Avenue South Norwood, my postman, my milkman, Paul Watkins and Keith Sansum.
I thank you.
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
11 September 2009
08:4228757#8
I Feel i must support Keith here .Nigel has been fortunate enough to be the
Portfolio Holder for Transport when all important discussions on the High Speed Train Link have taken place .No one person can take the credit .There are many councillors Labour ,Liberal and Conservative who work extremely hard ,some more than others .
Very soon Bleriot Court and Buckland Court will be opened will I get the credit for that ??No many people have been involved with it .William Muge ,Manley House,St Nicholas House all sheltered Housing schemes have been closed .Now will people remember me fore taking peoples homes away or on a positive note getting them in to better homes .
Catch my drift .There is an old saying the King is dead Long live the King
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
11 September 2009
08:4928759#9
does it matter what credit anyone gets susan?
i thought that politicos did things for personal satisfaction not for their ego.
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
11 September 2009
08:5828760#10
So did I Howard .Look closer to home and you will see whose name and picture and qoutes are in the papers .Mean while I will start another thread on Buses .
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
11 September 2009
09:0328761#11
I think its important though that the people who accomplish things get the credit. Its vital..history is made up with it. People who have accomplished this or that is noted, lauded and sometimes even condemned... So and so signed the peace treaty at Waterloo or whatever , and so on so on etc etc. Recognition for achievements is what motivates our politicians to bother to try to move us forward.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
11 September 2009
09:1628765#12
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
11 September 2009
10:0328767#13
Yes I agree Paul credit given when it is due is a great motivator but sadly there are some who manage to get in the picture .I recall being told by a councilllor get in the picture Sue move this way or stand here .Now I would never do that If Some one from the press is around they seek me out not the other way round .
THis is a very sore point with me .Someone in River did say they would plant a tree when I depart of this world in my memory .
Life is like that I* say speak well of people whilst they are here to hear it .
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
11 September 2009
11:2928774#14
thanks to you susan, we all now know who should get the credit for the sheltered housing.
Guest 684- Registered: 26 Feb 2009
- Posts: 635
11 September 2009
12:1028780#15
How about a statue of Sue in the Market Square next to the Telly By The Ellie?
Or maybe on the seafront when they move the miner to Fowlmead.
The campaign starts here...
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
11 September 2009
12:5328785#16
ED
Think you have missed the point completely
I never want any credit for anything i do, im just a pleb anyway.
All i was saying is that from the way the postings(some)state that ONLY Collor got high speed rail link. total crap.
Whats more worrying is that a number of ohers with far more influence than collor are getting angry at the overkill of naming just one person.
I would be saying this only the MP was mentioned or any other 1 person.
Before today I have stated there is a real danger of isolating the membership and making this a political forum for the tories, i wouldn't a dont support that.
just my view
ps;l thanks sue
howard
your right many do it for love
some
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
11 September 2009
19:1628806#17
interesting thought about our susan being celebrated as a statue in market square.
anyone who has visited the old eastern bloc countries will remember the statues of lenin and others with a finger pointing outwards as if a golden future is there.
we could have the same of susan with a finger pointed in the direction of the screen.
naturally, it would have to be a middle one.
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
11 September 2009
23:0728825#18
Dont forget the hat Howard .The one with large feathers i think .
Guest 670- Registered: 23 Apr 2008
- Posts: 573
11 September 2009
23:3828826#19
I agree with you Keith, Collor on his own as a councillor would have been totally insignificant to a rail company, he simply would not have had the 'clout'.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
12 September 2009
07:5928831#20
Thats probably a bit harsh Dave as someone from Dover had to take part in all those negotiations on the part of the town..to put the towns case as it were. Nigel Collor was transport guru at DDC and did indeed take part in all the discussions and did indeed put our case and as Ed said earlier..did become the face of the train. He got on well with the Transport Minister at the time Dr Stephen Ladyman which always helps in negotiation but of course isnt the deciding factor. But yes clearly others were involved and indeed Gwyn was too..lobbying at Westminster and so on. But a few faces led from the front, these guys mentioned above and Tim Ingleton too, who was the DDC officer concerned.
Nigel is still a member here so hopefully he will contribute to this thread.
As an aside..Ive had some statements in from him which I will put up on the frontpage when the space frees up.
