Guest 714- Registered: 14 Apr 2011
- Posts: 2,594
Well done Charlie and good luck to Neil Wiggins and all involved
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
yes mustn't forget the mastermind behind the concept and also there are at least two forum members serving on the board.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
You could have all the public in Dover on its board, but it will not happen.
Guest 705- Registered: 23 Sep 2010
- Posts: 661
Another skirmish in the Battle of the Port won by Charlie and the DPPT- well done and keep up the good work!
Never give up...
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,883
Vic, just because you are against it does not mean it will not happen, it might not but with a bit of luck it will.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
A major step, but we cannot be complacent. We have to keep lobbying to ensure the amendment is not taken out again at a later stage. Well done Charlie, keep it up!
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
A well crafted posting from Charlie, and I agree with Howard - how childish to try to reduce an important issue and an achievement such as this to a party political spat. Well done Charlie, a position of strength from which to do battle.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
It's a pity that a sane principle is not being taken into consideration:
European countries generally have a motorway toll, Britain doesn't.
A port toll on passing traffic would to an extent make up for this, and would therefore be in line with European countries.
A part of the toll would go to local administration (KCC, DDC, DTC).
Dover's financial crisis would be solved.
The same would apply to the Channel Tunnel, with benefits for Shepway, and to all British ports.
We're losing out heavily, every day. I estimate Dover Port could earn 500,000 pounds a day on an adequate port toll.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
European motorways are often built by the private sector at no cost to the government. The private operator collects the tolls until such time as the road is paid for and the road will then be handed over to the government, when tolls cease. A bit different from the way we piddle around with roads here.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Alexander D....
Absolutely...........Spot On....
No doubt there could have been an imaginative tunnel from Eastern to Western Docks....thus onto the M20....tolled from the Eastern Docks...paid for completely...
John Moir...recorded in Hansart or whatever...the recorder of Parliament...has him stating the people of Dover want this dual carriageway...nobody knew he was going to Parliament to state this.........Highways Agency did not want the tunnel...who says? The Traffic should have been tunnelled....not the people of Dover...with the crude underpass......sectioning it off from it's Town....
Also, we now have New Bridge...where the offices used to be, in the lovely buildings, now being left to rot....you know the signs when the hanging gardens of babylon start to appear....but, wait, we do have a Curry House at the end
Getting the transport to pay for the nightmare they produce on our roads would have been simple....but for some reason it never happens....what or who are they afraid of?
Now....wait for it....a huge lorry park at the Hoverport.........really? it is a disgrace....
The EU tolls its road, and so should we..............Wake up everyone and smell the coffee.............................herein lies a huge amount of untapped income.....
Townwall Street..........should never have happened.......it is a disgrace....
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Peter! You surprise me. Your information is very, very old!
What you describe was how in theory it was supposed to be in some European countries in the 50's!
However, no European country that imposed motorway tolls ever scrapped these once the mototways were paid off, but increased them each year.
Are you really not aware that in France, Italy and other countries, there are tolls on motorways?
Of-course anyone can confirm that there are, by just going over to Europe on a trip.
I wonder how your information on the People's Port is, if it is based on trumped out information like the piece above regards to European motorways.
It's a reason more to seriously doubt the whole idea of the P/p trust, which seems to be based on fantasy declarations to dispel any contrary proposal.
Germany introduced motorway tolls about 5 years ago for the first time, notwithstanding the motorays were already paid for.
Only here in Britain do we live in an era of Stone-Age when it comes to common-sense financing of our road facilities: the Europeans must think we are strange! Every truck can enter our Country with belly-tanks full of petrol and not pay a penny on petrol tax to us, and every vehicle can rumble through without paying a penny.
Peter, if you are sure of your above statement, try informing yourself more correctly! Many can tell you the exact opposite.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Charlie, the reason why the port-toll proposal does not get through, is because Mr. Elphicke, who knows about it, does not want it, because it would vanify his People's Port Trust projects.
In fact, with a port toll, there would be no need to either privatise Dover Port a la DHB, or to privatise Dover Port a la Monsieur Elphicke
Tout simple!
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Alex as an example: the 'autoroute des Anglais', the A26 from Calais to near Dijon, was built in the late 80s and early 90s by SANEF, a French joint-stock company with a minority government shareholding. SANEF has the concession to collect the tolls until about 2030 when the road will revert to public ownership. SANEF is a limited company and owns 1,745km of toll roads.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Peter, that means until 2030, anothyer 19 years. But that doesn't mean that the French State has plans to stop imposing a toll on that particular motorway in 2030.
Not only motorways, but some mountain tunnels in Europe, in particular the Alps, are heavily tolled.
Many European countries each earn many billions of euros or other currency every year on road tolls.
It is irrelevant whether the toll goes directly to the State, or to a private share-holding company, which in turn pays a lot of tax to the State on profits from road tolls.
In the latter case, the private company is also responsible for road maintainance along their stretch of motorway, relieving the State from these expenses.
The fact is, the P/p is a closed club society, that will not listen to any form of reason, and will have nothing to do with public consultation or considering other proposals and ideas.
I noticed this from the very start, that it's a kind of one man show of Neil Wiggans and a few others. Only their own views count for them, and nothing else.