just getting back to john and barryw's comments
i agree with both of you(blimey baz we agreeing a lot lol

)
Councillors are varied, some like the sound of there voice and can talk for England
whether thats always effective is at times debatable.
what used to annoy me was when 20 people got up to speak in the chamber adding nothing new to the first speaker yet the time it took.
cllrs are in the firing line, and like barryw the allowances will never cover for the loss of wages if you were not being a cllr.
I lost thousands of pounds over my 25 year period but enjoyed most of my time.
there has always been the debate on should cllrs be full time, but the cost would never be achieved so we do often end up with only those people able to give up time, ie un enemployed,. persons managing there own business's, peole willing working but having limited time/
Iadmire all cllrs of all political parties who put themselves forward, theres little thanks, but a lot expected of them.
As i'v stated earlier in postings the tory i replaced was a great speaker in the chamber but a poor community worker(which i learnt from him how not to the cllr role)and the labour person at the time stood down when i stood when i told him to stand i would like to go to selection to say our views he didnt, but others did which i encourage.