Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
19 August 2010
08:0666151#1
Following the latest legal ruling we have lost a Catholic Charity who have been doing sterling work in the adoption field.
For 100 years the Cathoilc Care charity have found decent homes for probably thousands of young children and now because their beliefs are at odds with the latest law their work will cease.
Surely Catholics, as with any other religious group, should be allowed their beliefs and should be allowed to pursue their beliefs. Whats the problem I hear you ask? the problem is that their conscience will not allow them to place kids for adoption with gay couples. This is a situation in religious terms that many people believe to be right. Its a widely held view but it is now at odds with the law. But note: The Catholic Care Charity are not trying to force their view on anyone else, but just want to carry on the work they are doing and have been doing for so long.
They have now been effectively blocked from operating in this marvellous field yet people on all sides recognise the brilliant work they do with kids and have done over 100 years. Even the reporter Justin Webb on Radio 4 this morning said roughly
"surely in a fully functioning society this isnt good, its a considerable loss"
I think this is right. Traditional solid work is axed due to modern political correctness.
Surely other charities could place kids with gay couples and fill the void and leave the Catholics to pursue the good work they do. That way everyone's a winner. But no...
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
19 August 2010
08:2266154#2
I totally agree PaulB. As a Catholic, and let's put to one side the recent priest abuse scandals, they do a lot of good and unsung work for charity .From the St Vincent De Paul volunteers that raise funds and give their time freely to help the poor and less abled of the parishes to the Little Sisters of the Poor that run non profit making residential care homes and dedicate their lives to the elderly. I hate to think what a furore this would cause had it been a muslim adoption agency that had been closed down!
As Catholics we take a vow to bring up our children in a Christian ,catholic loving enviroment what the hell is wrong with offering that to kids with no parents,no home or to childless couples?
We are quickly becoming a Jeremy Kyle type thug drinking, drug taking, wife beating society where kids are popped out into life not out of love but as a hope to claiming a council house and increased benefits.
Rant over.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 655- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,247
19 August 2010
08:3066155#3
It is disgusting - the whole of Labour's ill-conceived so called 'equality' legislation should be included in the great repeal bill.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
08:3266156#4
No charity or belief should be above the law.
I suspect there are other Catholic adoption agencies to carry on their good work, this one has just dug its heels in.
I say this as a non Catholic who was adopted during the war.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
19 August 2010
08:4266160#5
seems ludicrous to close down a charity for such a reason.
surely there are other agencies that allow gay couples to adopt?
all this will do is oput more pressure on these other agencies.
19 August 2010
11:5766179#6
And also mean less children being adopted.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
18:3966193#7
Sid...
Why will it mean less children being adopted.
The number of adoptive parents, gay or straight, will remain the same, it just means there is one less organisation dealing with adoptions .
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
19 August 2010
18:5866195#8
I'm as deeply suspicious of Catholicism as I am of Islam, yet I can't deny the good work being done when it comes to finding good homes for kids. The problem seems to be the definition of "good home" and it does look as though the Catholic version of a "good home" is one as described in the Bible, ie a married man and woman, probably with Christian values. I'm sorry but non-religious couples, gay couples, black-white-yellow-pink couples, take-your-bloody-pick couples, are all PERFECTLY CAPABLE of love and of offering kids a loving environment. The very fact that this organisation refused to house kids with gay couples proves one simple fact (and it is always the same no matter what religion you look at): They put their religious values BEFORE the needs of the children. It's never any different.
Sorry to all you god-types out there but perhaps religious groups are not really the best people to be tackling work like this these days? Surely it's best left to more secular, independent, people with a more balanced view of modern reality who are not hampered by such dogmatic judgmental rules?
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
19 August 2010
19:4166198#9
Rick
So who would you like to see in charge of adoption agencies? The lying,expenses claiming,politically motivated,scheming **stards that sit in the HofC? or the social workers that can tell the difference between abuse and good parenting.?
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
19 August 2010
20:0166203#10
let's have a look at a few facts of this organisation, they have been going for over 150 years, the only proviso as far as i can se is over the sexuality of prospective adopters.
the age range is from 21 to infinity, providing there is no more than 45 years between the adopter and adoptee.
smokers can adopt after assessment, obviously asthmatic children would not be put into a smoking household.
obesity is taken into account, a few other things but they seem to have an exemplary record, race and religion is never taken into account.
19 August 2010
20:4466213#11
I object to kids having to be brought up eating halal meat - does that mean we will discriminate against islamic couples? I don't think so.
Howard and PaulB are absolutely right - the bigger picture has been completely missed. What a waste.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
21:1266217#12
Cathoilc Care could have accepted the law as it now stands and stayed open but they have decided not to let gay people adopt.
Maybe the children in their care will be better off in an organisation that does not have such outdated narrow minds.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
19 August 2010
22:1366229#13
Thank you Jan. This organisation is no longer providing its services because it refused to compromise on its prejudicial religious stance. Putting its religious values before the welfare of the people it "cared" for.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
19 August 2010
22:2166232#14
not quiet as simple as that rick, if they believe something is wrong it is more honest to stick by their beliefs than pretend to go along with things to appear cool and trendy.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
22:2266234#15
Rick...
I do not really believe that religion comes into the arguement, it is just an excuse used by a narrow minded group of people who run this charity.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Ross Miller
- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
19 August 2010
22:3366242#16
Er so if one is catholic one cannot be gay?
Or is it if one is gay and catholic one has no rights with the catholic church?
Whilst I was baptised, christened, had my first communion and my confirmation in the Catholic Church; I chose, when I was old enough not to have to do what pleased my mother, to cease to be associated with a hypocritical, reactionary and corrupt organisation that ignored peoples rights, abused children, yet at the same time preached compassion and tolerance. Honestly if it wasn't true you would struggle to make it up.
Marx & Engels were absolutely right, even now religion is stupefying the masses and being used as an excuse and justification for appalling behaviour the world over.
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
19 August 2010
22:4466255#17
Sorry Ross. Have I upset you, if so I apologise.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Ross Miller- Location: London Road, Dover
- Registered: 17 Sep 2008
- Posts: 3,709
19 August 2010
22:5266266#18
No not you Jan
"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today." - James Dean
"Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength,
While loving someone deeply gives you courage" - Laozi
19 August 2010
22:5566269#19
Rick they don't seem to have a problem with keeping little boys for themselves. Perhaps that's normal in Germany as Mr Pope doesn't seem to be too worried about it.
Ross, spot on mate. Religion is just a means to subjugate the masses, sadly it works very well.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
20 August 2010
07:4966287#20
Religion no longer subjugates the masses Sid. Well not in the West anyway. All religions seem to have tangented themselves off into different directions and different pockets, some large pockets and some not so large, and none playing a significant part in state.
There is freedom to practice your religion in the West no matter what it is.
One must always remember that people active in religions have very solid beliefs. They beleive. It is important to remember about beliefs. Most people nowadays dont beleive in anything so perhaps it is not always easy to understand those with beliefs. So if your religion has a set of beliefs that forbids you to do something.. then so be it. Fair enough. You are not trying to foister your beliefs on anyone else but are simply following your own beliefs.
Unfortunately in the case mentioned the Catholic Churce Care Group cannot now pursue their excellent work which benefitted many, because they are not allowed to exercise their religious beliefs/practice, by new law.