Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#21
only time will tell on this,i will keep an eye this to see if any "traffic lights" will turn up on the western hieghts roundabout....I will not be holding my breath on this as it would prove fatal.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#22
work stated around 9 pm last night after a slow start.more workers than you can shake a stick at.
Ian Handley
- Location: Norfolk UK
- Registered: 30 Oct 2013
- Posts: 412
#23
Pardon my ignorance but having just read the Dover Express report, do I understand the following correctly.
Port bound freight traffic will be separated by signage from non-port / local and port bound tourist vehicles.
The port bound freight traffic will be 'held' by traffic lights (presumably under the control of DHB Terminal Control), until such time that space is available within the port.
If my understanding is correct, I assume that the planners / authorities assume that the freight vehicle at the front of the queue - let's say driven by a guy from one of the East European countries - that he, and his colleagues in the queue behind him will sit patiently at the red light for 5, 10, 20, 30 minutes - whilst other traffic passes by?
Please do not think I'm being negative, it's great that the problem appears at last to being addressed such that my beloved home town and its citizens environment and lives are improved.
On a historical note, whilst I currently do not live in Dover I frequently visit relatives in the town and indeed when I worked for DHB (1978-95) myself and 4 colleagues formed the first 'team' who operated what later became known as 'Operation Stack' - at the time it was called " 5 of you get in a van - drive up to the other side of Folkestone and hold the freight"!
Ian Handley
Former Operations Controller DHB Terminal Control (1978-1995)
Dover born (1946) & bred, Moved from area in 1999 - family still living in Dover
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#24
A20 now open fully.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#25
ian,i can fully understand what you are saying.it confused me to,still am.
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#26
I wondered about that as well Ian, some foreign lorry drivers seem to have scant regard for our traffic rules. I certainly hope I am wrong to have my doubts.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#27
Not enough police around to enforce the new system, hopefully I am proved wrong too.
Ian Handley- Location: Norfolk UK
- Registered: 30 Oct 2013
- Posts: 412
#28
Pleased I'm not alone in understanding this plan!
Like Brian I also think that holding the traffic at Aycliffe is wrong and surely short sighted. Surely a very large freightt service area south of Ashford would serve both tunnel and port congestion as required.
This should not be financed directly by Dover, Shepway Or Ashford citizens rather by a levy imposed on ALL cross channel freight movements. It's high time both the fixed and flexible elements operated as a 'Initigrated transport system' (where have I heard that before)? I realise there are commercial interests to consider but the Dover area and most important it's citizens should not have to bare the inadequacies of the current operations.
Ian Handley
Former Operations Controller DHB Terminal Control (1978-1995)
Dover born (1946) & bred, Moved from area in 1999 - family still living in Dover
Guest 1694- Registered: 24 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,087
#29
What's happening on the A20 now is to provide immediate relief for Dover from the almost daily gridlock, but it will not end with this scheme. It is being put in place now because it is the quickest way to deliver what we've all been crying out for and is part of a package which, I am led to believe, will include a port traffic pre-check and process zone/yard off the M20 plus a series of smaller lorry parks up through Kent along the M20 and A2/M2 networks.
There are also major improvements announced today for the A2 from Brenley Corner to the port. These more long term solutions for our problems will take a bit longer to implement and will also require the cooperation of all the various agencies and an interconnected computer management system. It is amazing how quickly funds are released to begin implementing the changes we all need once the realisation dawns on the powers that be that the Port of Dover and the roads that link it inland are of National Strategic Importance.
I think that we probably have the disgruntled stockbrokers of Tunbridge Wells and Sevenoaks, who were inconvenienced back in January, as well as the previous and ongoing continuous pressure of our local representatives, the Port and many local businesses and private individuals to thank for getting the issue raised to the level of a national strategic priority - which is where it should be.
Guest 715- Registered: 9 Jun 2011
- Posts: 2,438
#30
The pre check and process zone sounds very interesting Neil, is the intention to replace the check ins at the Eastern Docks? if not there will be a staffing implication for the Ferry companies and DHB. Good to see that finally the problems are being addressed .
Audere est facere.
Karlos- Location: Dover
- Registered: 1 Oct 2012
- Posts: 2,599
#31
What are the improvements from Brenley Corner to Dover?
Guest 1694- Registered: 24 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,087
#32
Hi Martin, Passport checks will still have to be done immediately prior to boarding at the Eastern Docks under the new outgoing checks regime.
I am not party to the details of how the off-dock pre-check and process zone will work or the impact that this will have on staff at the docks here in Dover, but the way in which it works elsewhere in the world where such schemes have been implemented is that; port traffic flows into the zone direct from the road network and checks into a parking spot. Once parked up, all the paperwork is dealt with and checked against information already held online or entered to the relevant system. They are then assigned a time slot for the journey down to the port. When their time arrives, they leave their parking slot and are automatically booked out of the zone via OCR (Number plate recognition cameras) technology as they join the convoy to the docks to catch their vessel. OCR at the dock gates confirms the right vehicle has turned up at the right time for the right sailing and lifts the barrier, with unconfirmed/booked vehicles being turned round on a 'feeder loop' and redirected back to the zone to get properly booked in. Of course, I simplify.
To embed such a system and link up the various IT systems will take some time, but once done can (and does elsewhere) reduce or eliminate port traffic congestion in the vicinity of the port. The works on the A20 and the principle of pre-marshalling vehicles before they enter the final approaches to the port are, I believe, a precursor to a much more comprehensive and long term change to the way in which port traffic is handled before it enters the confines of Dover Town.
Guest 1694- Registered: 24 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,087
#33
Hi Karlos - Announced today was that funding was being made available to turn that section of the A2 into a 'Mini Motorway'. Again, details are a bit scant, but I assume that this means junction changes, removal of traffic lights and dualling.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#34
When their time arrives, they leave their parking slot and are automatically booked out of the zone via OCR (Number plate recognition cameras) technology as they join the convoy to the docks to catch their vessel. OCR at the dock gates confirms the right vehicle has turned up at the right time for the right sailing and lifts the barrier, with unconfirmed/booked vehicles being turned round on a 'feeder loop' and redirected back to the zone to get properly booked in. Of course, I simplify.
Pre-empted my question there Neil which was what would happen when a driver pretends to play dumb and try to jump the queue. The system you describe sounds like the full answer to Dover's needs hopefully someone will grasp the nettle and implement it.
Guest 687- Registered: 2 Jun 2009
- Posts: 513
#35
There are numerous logistics companies based in Whitield, will we have to drive up the A20 from Dover and join the back of the queue? There are also many drivers who use the A2 in preference to the A20 so presumably they must also do the same.
On the point of foreign drivers ignoring our traffic laws, they do so because they can. As we all know' there is no law without enforcement'.
All drivers in Europe including myself are aware of the strict enforcement of traffic laws in Europe and ensure we try not to break them.
Paul Watkins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 9 Nov 2011
- Posts: 2,226
#36
Ken , the problem of local haulage firms has been identified & is part of an exercise to find a solution that recognises their dilemma creating a local solution. Nigel is on to this one as he is working with HA,KCC & DHB on the A20 solutions.
Guest 687- Registered: 2 Jun 2009
- Posts: 513
#37
Couldn't be in better hands. As an added bonus Charlie has asked to meet the directors of the company I drive for for a meeting to discuss security issues when arriving at Calais, he is definitely proactive on all traffic issues,well done to him.
Jan Higgins- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#38
Ken, we definitely need to enforce our traffic laws regardless of whether it is a foreign car or lorry.
Apart from the resentment their flouting causes think of the extra revenue the country would receive, surely it would be self financing to clamp these drivers until they have paid up.
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I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
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Guest 1694- Registered: 24 Feb 2016
- Posts: 1,087
#39
Re my posts #29 and #33 - Too quick off the mark and jumping to conclusions about the A2 from Brenley Corner - sorry.
I heard about removing roundabouts and traffic lights from the A2 and turning it into a 'mini motorway' and got all excited, thinking about our section with traffic lights and roundabouts. For a day I was under the impression that long overdue works and vital improvements were approved in the most necessary places. It turns out that the A2 through SE London to Kent (already a pretty good piece of road) is the bit that will be turned into a 'mini motorway'; so more money being poured into a pretty good bit of road that hardly needs it and nothing for the A2 in East Kent where it is really needed NOW.
Guest 1266- Registered: 8 May 2014
- Posts: 381
#40
Absolutely Neil, its incredible the amount of money being spent on transport infrastructure around London and yet as you say Dover which is of national significance has to cope with a single carriageway on the A2. Driving from Dover to Whitfield this morning on the A2 I have to say I was shocked at the amount of rubbish along the verges.
Jack of Hearts