Guest 691- Registered: 24 Oct 2009
- Posts: 45
26 October 2009
20:4331644#1
What's the point of school? What are we trying to achieve in an education system? Does it do what we want it to do?
Reading, 'riting and 'rithmetic?
Creating the next generation of labour?
Babysitting service? Keeping kids occupied?
Making well rounded and upright citizens?
Qualifications and competing in a globalised world?
Is the National Curriculum fit for purpose? Why do we teach kids discrete subjects like geography, history, maths, languages etc.?
Would be very interested to hear your views.
"In this world there are 10 sorts of people - those that understand binary and those that don't."
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
26 October 2009
20:5631645#2
approximately all of them, a lot depends on the parents as well as on the teaching staff.
school is not just somewhere to park the kids for 6 hours.
if you ask a lot employers the 3 r's do not seem to be part of the curriculum, the country will be unable to compete without a more qualified workforce in future.
will think about it and add more later.
should be many replies on this one.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
26 October 2009
20:5731646#3
When I was at school in the late 50s and 60s Matthew, both primary and secondary, I had the interests I have today. But, at school, there was nothing to stimulate my interests. I found much of it boring. Brook Bond tea cards, which were free in a packet of tea, had a space series, but there was nothing at school to promote my interests. I loved geography, but not drawing contours and all that, I wanted to read about other countries. I had to pinch books from school to read what I was interested in. Still have a couple today. My children didn`t have much interest in much of what was being taught either, so hasn`t changed alot. Just to add, my post from the other day, `SCHOOL, the happiest days of your life?` recieved no replies. Don`t know if that says something?
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 672- Registered: 3 Jun 2008
- Posts: 2,119
26 October 2009
21:2231650#4
A good subject this one, thanks for bringing it online Matt.
A bit like Colin really, had no interest and nothing to stimulate me, so at the age of 15yrs I left and joined the army.
Carried on with education but at the same time I did a lot of things that interested me. The amount I learnt in two years far out weighed my whole school education and enjoyed nearly every minute of it.
Funny how things work out innit. 53yrs old and I'm back at school again.
grass grows by the inches but dies by the feet.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
26 October 2009
21:3031654#5
Same here Ian. I`ve been really into science the last 10 years or so. Not test tubes and bunsen burners, but what you see in my posts. I think we should have the job and money to start with, then go to school when we`re 16, or earlier if we want. I`ve always said a 2 year old could do what some politicians do. Done an open university course once, but couldn`t get my head round the maths. Might try again someday. Going back onto Matthews post though, does anybody do surveys on pupils to see what they look for in the present education system?
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 672- Registered: 3 Jun 2008
- Posts: 2,119
26 October 2009
21:3631655#6
I see a big pointer coming out already on this one Colin.
It's very clear to see these days that a lot of adults didn't want to learn at school OR afterwards, hence the problems we have now.
particularly disciplin.
grass grows by the inches but dies by the feet.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
26 October 2009
21:4131657#7
Yep Ian. You cane someone, and you`re a sadist. Actually, I got the cane a couple of times. In these enlightned times, I wonder if it`s too late to sue my teacher for assault if he`s still alive? Any do gooders out there to help me? Any lawyers? No win no fee.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 691- Registered: 24 Oct 2009
- Posts: 45
26 October 2009
21:5631660#8
As someone "new" to the Forum I wasn't aware of your other thread, sorry Colin.
Your experiences are not unusual. Some schools, including local ones (Marsh Academy being one), have decided to abolish discrete subjects in first year of secondary. Instead, the kids learn through "project based learning". There are still specific learning objectives and outcomes attached to each lesson, but they are not restricted on a subject basis. Who knows what questions might arise from a lesson, and which things kids most want to explore about a project. Access to ICT makes these sorts of lessons all the more effective - teacher is a "facilitator" and not an oracle.
Everyone has a bias towards a certain learning style. I can remember stuff best that I've heard spoken or verbalised, but others prefer the visual or diagrammatic, others prefer to learn by doing, hands on, practical. Some even learn best by diving in and making mistakes. A good teacher will make use of all approaches over the course of a year, and won't always get the textbook out and lecture and drill. Two weeks ago my Year 7s were doing long division over and over again until they could do it automatically, but then in the next lesson we sang a song about how to find the area of a trapezium. In another lesson we made posters "An idiot's guide to negative numbers". With the Year 8's, I was teaching pre-decimal currency and rather than do 10 questions from a book, I got them to design a role play where they used old money etc... I am by no means an outstanding teacher, but I try to have a variety of experiences.
What do people think about project based learning? Or are we attached to discrete subjects? Does the curriculum have the right subjects in it? If not, what is missing?
"In this world there are 10 sorts of people - those that understand binary and those that don't."
Guest 672- Registered: 3 Jun 2008
- Posts: 2,119
26 October 2009
21:5831661#9
A pearl this one Colin, it's been on the forum many times.
Smoking is bad for you, our leaders banned it in public.
Disciplin is good for you, our leaders banned it.
This place is crazy.
grass grows by the inches but dies by the feet.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
26 October 2009
22:0931665#10
Funny old world Ian. Though crazy does sound better. No probs Matthew, I`m a newcomer as well, and there may even have been another thread before me, I haven`t gone through them all yet, too many interesting things going on here at the present. Your way certainly sounds more interesting than the old ways, but I won`t pretend to understand it. Sounds like what I`d have been happy with in my school days. As Howard said above, you should get some good replies on this.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
26 October 2009
22:2031670#11
my experience sounds like that of ian and colin.
bored out of my skull and left with nothing.
the new progressive stuff was just coming in when i left.
i always remember this scouse teacher coming in wearing cords and desert boots walking like john wayne and saying "hi i'm paul".
a reply from a kid at the back "hi, i'm mr newman"
Guest 666- Registered: 25 Mar 2008
- Posts: 323
27 October 2009
00:3831676#12
Interesting post this.
My personal experience of school from the 60's to the 70's was a slow descent into complete ambivalence to the teaching.
The only part I enjoyed was doing voluntary service around the village instead of the nightmare of football / x-country etc, out on cold, soaked fields.
The last year of school (1978) was a godsend, I was able to pursue my own path without constraint in the 6th form and excelled in Photography, Art and in the end of year Revue; plus home economics came in and in the CCF I got to pilot a plane over Wales.
The curriculum went to the wall and I felt far better for it, however it all came to an abrupt end when jobsearching with only 4 'O' levels and 2 'CSE's', I wish I had had the elbow grease to get down to the job in hand then.
I am now in the part of parent with two children at secondary school and am attending classes again myself to get an insight into the teaching methods and the path they are now following that is so different from my own experience; I hope to be able to grasp the nettle of education again for their sakes and have even been back to my old scool (with my kids) after a long time (30yrs)...finding that so much has changed for the better.
I do not profess to understand it at all and can only hope that it will prepare them for their future, the lot I went through certainly did not seem at all relevant at the time.
Oh Boy!, That'll be the day.........
27 October 2009
07:4531685#13
I was in a convent........I learned a great deal about pain and prayer. Oh, I also had a brilliant education and read almost all the time.
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
27 October 2009
08:0131688#14
Bern
Well said
I went to an all boys grammar and was buggered senseless ...did me the power of good..... Ok before any complaints are lodged thats a line from 4 weddings and a funeral.
One gets out of school exactly what one puts in.It prepares one for a later working life of discipline.ie "Got up got out of bed dragged a comb across my head"....oops sorry a Beatles line from a song..
The surprise arrival of my 9 yr old daughter(9 years ago not just recently..if you know what I mean..erm)means that I have been able to witness modern day teaching habits and practices and I think they are great.
The school has its own website and she has her own web page.Homework assistance can be gleaned from the net and if she gets in any difficulty she can email the teacher for advice.She loves school and works hard because its interesting exciting and informative and so much different than from when I was at school.
Ink monitors are from the Victorian age arent they Daddy......
'Chalk'..Oh how exciting that must have been Daddy was that afore you went to work in't mill at 14 wi'clogs on...she mutters
The schools of today are far superior than in my day and we should thank all those that work hard within the education system and thank the Govt for pouring money into education where other parties hope to make 'unseen' cuts.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
27 October 2009
15:0231712#15
Blimey this is going to go on and on I think.
From my own personal point of view school didnt realy help mre much at all still baffled me why as i went through all the catholic schools and this is not an attack on them, why did they do mass in latin that most of the kids didnt even understand you only knew it was over when people started to leave(no im joking on the last bit)
I left very early but in the main have been gainfully employed, i have been lucky enough very rarely to have to rely on the state have been gainfully employed most of my life.
What i did learn was that if you got hit across the knuckles with a ruler it hurt si i only got that once!
got plenty of blackboard dusters and chalk thrown at me(remember them)
In my job i have to visit schools a lot and at times teachers have said would you like to use the white board, although iv agreed iv always found it easier to speak verbally.
On the issue of disipline, I don't think this can be totaly associated with school/home life.
When I was young we were poor and living in tower hamlets, but I had strict parents who tauhght me right from wrong, so its not about being better educated, it may be about better parenting?
These days kids do need to be listened to, and helped as so many things have changed since my short time.
I go into primary schools amazed at some of the things I see in my job maybe i will share some of them with you, but don't want to bore you all
Guest 662- Registered: 18 Mar 2008
- Posts: 325
27 October 2009
15:0931714#16
In the case of my Son - I do see School as a babysitting service - joke!!!! My Son has ADHD and his School is amazing, the support he receives has meant that his education may not suffer, they dont always stick to the curriculum with him as they have creatively found ways to teach him in a manner he enjoys and keeps him interested. It took us a while to get this stage and as Parents we had to push to achieve our current status for our Son but now it is in place the School have the resources to take it forward and we have alot to thank them for.
In our case it was not the School but the Education System that let us down, fighting for the School to get the funding they needed to give our Son the necessary tools and teaching assistants etc....
My daughter on the other hand is at Secondary School (just) and she is experiencing some of this "Project Based" learning and I have to say that she is more interested and seems to retain more information in working this way.
I myself found School a bore and like someone else above left and joined the Army as soon as I could. I hope my children will get more out of it.
Sheli. x