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    I have 4 children Howard, and i wouldn't dream of saying I had nothing back from the state (although we have never claimed unemployment benefits or not worked because of the children - we always sorted ourselves out so that we worked and cared for the children and brought them up to understand that they need to be self sufficient and work hard. I have always been there for them, they have been our priority, but we have managed that in tandem with work and careers, and done it well, I think!!! Hard work but worth it!) But it is people like you and I who bear a large brunt, disproportionately, of the costs for our society in lots of ways including financial and the effects of crime. People who work less or earn less pay less back (obviously!) and people who earn more/have more pay accountants to hide it so they pay less than they need to!! It is you and I, firmly in the middle, who proportionatley pay more of our incomes and experience more challenges.

    I also have to say: whatever we have had from the state - child benefit, schooling, whatever - has been earned and some.

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