Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
09:0137841#1
Today on the news it was announced that on the shortlist of 3 a woman is on the shortlist to become bishop.
I don't have any hangups with women taking on these roles, but it has caused real grief within the christian movement, and splits appeared because of it.
Wonder what you all think?
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
16 January 2010
10:4637851#2
All down the centuries, women have been sidelined in a male dominated world. Too much information for me to put on here, as you could speak volumes. A couple of women I do have sound knowledge of, and who were shunned in the early/middle part of the last century were Cecilia Payne, a brilliant English scientist, who emigrated to the States because she was unwelcome at Cambridge. While over there, she discovered the sun was using hydrogen as nuclear fuel, but the ignorant, arrogant, dominating males in the science community of the (great?) USA wouldn`t have it, because she was female, and they wern`t allowed to work in leading science. Lise Meitner, (one of Germany`s leading scientist`s in pre-war days) had similar problems in Europe. I could go on with others. Read up on them. To your original posting Keith, it comes as no surprise to me whatsoever, as religion has a poor record for the treatment of our female gender. But I was always brought up that we should love and respect one another.
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
16 January 2010
11:1737858#3
Well today there is a possibility that all that can be put right. It was very interesting though at one time, women were the biggest denunciators of women coming forward in such roles. That was most certainly the case. People love the status quo, particularly the regular attenders. However women in recent times have been playing more of a role so maybe the time has come. But as was said on R4 this morning she is actually the outsider for the job and is up against two highly quialified men. However this particular branch of Chritianity might make the gesture.
But as Keef says there it could cause splits, as we have seen with the gay bishop scenario. Some of these issues completely fragment thinking and harmony and as a consequence are probably overall very negative as they split the Church assunder.
One only had to hear Iris Robinson, Member of Stormont, wife of the First Minister of Northern Ireland speaking the other day on Panorama..she's a devout church goer and in the programme described homosexuality as a "total abomination" This from a devout church goer! Many in the various branches of the Christian Church have very strong views on maintaining the status quo. Trying to convince them otherwise is a very very tough job.
Guest 693- Registered: 12 Nov 2009
- Posts: 1,266
16 January 2010
11:3137860#4
I know from my own experiences within the Church of England that the extremely high feelings over the ordination of women priests have not subsided. Allowing them to become Bishops will make many leave the Church altogether (I hasten to add that I won't be one) in favour of the Roman Catholic Church where the Pope will not permit this to happen.
I understand the problem although I don't share it; quite what the opposition to women clergy is, I don't know. In fact, I believe that in future generations, women clergy will be accepted as the norm, although I am not convinced the C of E will survive the schism that will inevitably follow if the Anglican Church goes ahead with it all.
True friends stab you in the front.
16 January 2010
11:3537862#5
With reference to PaulB's second sentence, if I were the Church of England I certainly would not enter a chess contest.
They obviously have difficulty telling their queens from their bishops.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
16 January 2010
11:3637863#6
loved it bob, wish i had though of that.
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
16 January 2010
13:2637888#7
Comon lads posts 5 or 6 dont add to the debate,...am interested what do you think on the issue. Came back in to see the contributions.
Andy yes the Catholic Church have been looking to expand their 'market share' by recruiting or being receptive to other church groups who are having internal disorder. The Catholics appear to stick rigidly to their core rules that have stood them in good stead for so long, and this is appealing to others who see their own values disperse, or being dispersed for them. They are actually one of the few christian church groups that are growing rather than contracting. A recent report said they were now the leading church here in the UK...which in turn initiated the debate on the Royalty/Catholic situation.
Guest 645- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 4,463
16 January 2010
13:4037896#8
I am agin female Catholic priests. I have no logical explanation for this dread other than a strict RC upbringing bound in tradition and custom. My poor ol' departed Dad said that if the Good Lord had wanted female priests he would have picked a few as his Apostles.
Female lay preachers do distribute Holy Communion at Catholic Masses but again I'm not too sure about this either as during Mass the Priest has gone through a ritual and series of washing and cleansing of his hands prior to giving Holy Communion to the congregation.The Lay Preachers have not they just get up from their pews and get on with it thus I never go to a lay person to receive communion.
Bring back Latin Masses..it mean't that wherever you went in the world you could attend Mass and understand what was going on.However I must admit that on my travels around the globe most churches advertise and have masses said in English.Over here there are Masses in Polish for the overseas workers.
The after mass vodka tho' is from Warrington.
Marek
I think therefore I am (not a Tory supporter)
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
13:4337899#9
Paulb?
Thankyou, maybe a straw poll, are you able to do this on here?
Further to my post Whilst we may not have strong views on women becoming bishops, We maybe should be concerned about the splits?
Guest 693- Registered: 12 Nov 2009
- Posts: 1,266
16 January 2010
15:5437918#10
As far as the UK is concerned, there are huge constitutional issues that would need to be resolved if the RC Church extended its influence greatly....given that even as far as local government level, our way of government is founded upon Anglican parish boundaries, a matter of constitutional reform would be required if the C of E became a minority religion.
So, for me, the debate over whether women should be allowed to become priests has greater significance than that single issue alone; it's more about whether or not the Anglican Church should modernise its thinking or not. By doing so, it would alienate many of its members for whom traditional values are being eroded, and with a dwindling congregation, could the C of E continue to have the influence at senior level. Should, for example, the C of E continue to have seats in the House of Lords? Strikes me their continued presence in that august body would have only the weakest justification in such a scenario.
It's a house of cards.........
True friends stab you in the front.
Guest 690- Registered: 10 Oct 2009
- Posts: 4,150
16 January 2010
18:1637926#11
Interesting replies above, though I`m still no wiser. Is it because religion has always historically been the male domain, or is it that women are not wanted in the post, as per above?
Tell them that I came, and no one answered.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
16 January 2010
19:0237936#12
firstly andy makes a very valid point about the constitutional issues that surround the church of england.
i cannot see any justification for the clergy in the house of lords, but once they get the order of the boot then disestablishment is on the cards.
all very complicated.
colin
the lady did not get the job at interview, so we will not know what problems this would have caused.
religion does seem a mainly male domain, yet judaism has female rabbis even though the males take precedence in the synagogue, men at the front, women at the back.
i doubt whether catholicism will ever accomodate women priests in the forseeable future.
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
16 January 2010
20:4837957#13
sounds like both faiths have a bad case of bishop bashing.as a non believer i not particuly botherd either way.what happend to equall rights and all that pc stuff we keep hereing about.or is the church now a gentlemans club and dont want women to join.
17 January 2010
01:4837985#14
PaulB I can only apologise for my posting above which, as you pointed out, did not add to this important debate ( And all in the hope of getting an easy laugh).
I am however pleased that I managed to restrain myself from telling you about the headline I saw in a national paper a few years ago which simply stated 'Bishops split by homosexual practices'.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
17 January 2010
09:5238000#15
BRIAN
Sadly yes you are right, in many parts of the church women being in control are frowned upon.
Do needs to get up to date.
Bob, I was trying to get a serious debate on this subject, nice to have a laugh, but maybe not on this posting, not to worry.