ORIENT EXPRESS RETURNS FOR THIRD 2012 'DISCOVER DEAL' VISIT
- 11 August 2012 07:47186762This is another one for the diary..
Many thanks to Nick Stevens for the info coming through.
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ORIENT EXPRESS RETURNS FOR THIRD 2012 'DISCOVER DEAL' VISIT
The world-famous Orient Express train pulls into Deal for the third of four UK Pullman 'Discover Deal' excursions in 2012 on Saturday 18th August.
Visitors to Deal travelling on board the train from London Victoria will arrive at 1.15pm and following two hours' free time in Deal will then return to London Victoria, departing Deal at 3.45pm.
Founders of Deal station's new café 'Platform 1', Nick and Andy Stevens said:"Following the fantastic welcome hundreds of local people have given Orient Express passengers on previous 'Discover Deal' visits, we are delighted to welcome back the train and guests for the third time this year. Once again the famous train's visit to Deal presents a unique opportunity to showcase the town and create the best of impressions for many visitors whom we hope will return to experience and enjoy what the town has to offer."
"As well as directing visitors to Deal's popular town centre establishments and attractions during their two hour stay, the retro style design and theme of our 'Platform 1' café is very much in keeping with the history of the world's most prestigious train and the glorious era of luxury travel the train itself evokes and we look forward to welcoming new visitors to our café and Deal itself."
'Platform 1' is open Monday to Friday from 05.30am to 5.30pm and on Saturdays from 07.00am to 5.30pm, serving a range of hot and cold drinks, snacks and selection of newspapers.
email: dover7@msn.com - 11 August 2012 09:08186773It's so beautiful.
- 12 August 2012 07:08186871The train, or Platform 1 Jeane - of course you may have meant Deal itself.
Roger - Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
12 August 2012 08:49186890doh,deal again.
- 12 August 2012 15:21186916That's because there's no one organising these kind of things for Dover Brian - you can't blame Deal; well done to them.
Roger - Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
12 August 2012 16:39186925roger,its about time some one did organise somthing like that in dover. - 12 August 2012 17:39186931i really don't think dover is a destination for these passengers as things stand.
they will be looking for charming bistros, eateries and boozers coupled with non national chain niche market shops. - 12 August 2012 20:00186960Whether it's the Orient Express, or a wonderful old Steam-train, I'm sure something pretty good could be organised, if they had a cpouple of hours sor sothere was a will. The big stumbling block is watering a steam engine.
A bus/coach could pick up the passengers and take them to the Transport Museum and then Crabble Corn Mill. I'm sure that a local dignatory or two would be happy to welcome them.
Roger - 13 August 2012 07:03187002Roger its not a steam engine...
quite an ordinary dated deisel at the front end.
Here is a pic of it taken at its last visit to Deal. Platform quite crowded waiting for it to arrive..twas a lovely atmosphere.
In a way I hated to shatter the steam engine dream there..but said engine was a bit of a let down.
But it's all about the oppulence of the carriages inside and out..though would still have loved a steam engine myself.
Mayor of Deal welcomed all last time with assorted others..and special greeters. Very pleasant.email: dover7@msn.com - 13 August 2012 07:30187007I know it wasn't/isn't a steam engine Paul, that why I put the Orient Express "or" a steam engine.
Both different themes - apart from both are high on nostalgia.
Roger - Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
13 August 2012 07:32187008so is the golden arrow,but i think thats now razor blades i do beliuve. - 13 August 2012 07:37187010Ah yes indeed Roger..I misread that there for a minute. Still...it gave me a chance to have a bit of a dream as it would be fantastic to see it pulled with a steam engine.. twould bring out a touch of the Hercule Poirot's n all that!
On the day above I was disappointed with the engine, dont know what I was expecting, but the head is full of romantic nonsense. There wasnt a shady spy to be seen either!
email: dover7@msn.com - Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
13 August 2012 07:41187012paul,moraraty was lurking in the back ground.
- 13 August 2012 08:46187017lol!
Oh you are wicked Brian!
No I didnt spot Sherlock Holmes either, never mind Moriarty or even Poirot..crushed...
still, maybe next time which is of course next saturday. Sadly I wont be able to make this one.
email: dover7@msn.com - 13 August 2012 09:11187021Re #8: Taking water would not be a problem as they could use a road tanker, as they do at Folkestone West for the steam tours which pass through Dover.
I should think the sticking point would be lack of anywhere for the train to be stabled for a couple of hours whilst the passengers savour the delights of Dover, as they do at Canterbury.
All the track round Dover has been pulled up, and the three platforms at Dover Priory are in constant use.
Here is a photo of Schools Class 4-4-0 "Eton" taking water at Dover Priory back in Southern Railway days.
- 13 August 2012 10:25187034Thanks for the Platform 1 publicity again, Paul.
Hope to see you all on Saturday when the Orient Express makes its third stop of the summer in Deal.
Cheers,
Andy and Nick Stevens
facebook.com/platform1deal
#platform1deal on Twitter - 14 August 2012 05:44187121Were those tracks taken up recently Ed ? I understood from the station manager that the track wasn't a problem just the watering.
Roger - 18 August 2012 13:07187664All of the immense system of railway tracks serving the docks in Dover was taken up donkeys years ago, Roger. It was all still in existence when I first arrived in Dover in 1987 and I have to pinch myself to believe that it has all gone without a trace, mostly concreted over for the road vehicles which have replaced the railway freight trucks. All the multiplicity of lines in the Western Docks have gone, including the sidings along Shakespeare Beach which used to house the continental freight wagons before the train ferry was rendered superfluous by the construction of the channel tunnel.
There are just the bare twin tracks of the mainline remaining. Therefore the only place where a steam train could halt in Dover for a couple of hours for a steam special would have to be in Dover Priory. One wrinkle that causes problems elsewhere but not in Dover is the lack of a turntable to turn a steam engine around. Fortunately, steam trains can come in from London on the original LCDR line via the Priory Tunnel and straight ahead back to London on the original SER line via the Harbour Tunnel. There were turntables at Dover Priory, the Marine Station throat, and the old Dover Town station sidings on the beach - later the site of the engine shed - but they all disappeared with the end of steam. It is still possible for a steam engine to run around its train in Dover Priory as there are crossovers at both ends of the Priory station. It could therefore go back the same way but with tender first running, which is frowned upon.
Interesting that the station manager states that the track is not a problem, just the watering, as I would have assumed it to be the other way around. All three platforms are in use for the Victoria, Charing Cross and High Speed to St.Pancras trains so I would have imagined that Southeastern would not look kindly on having one platform tied up for a couple of hours by a steam special. There are two sidings but these would also present problems. The train would have to come into a platform first for the passengers to alight. If it came in from the Folkestone end, then possibly it could pull forward and reverse into a siding should one be vacant. Not sure if it is permissible to reverse a mainline train in such a fashion even with the benefit of walkie talkies at either end. In steam days, a shunter would have pulled a train into a terminus platform whereupon the mainline engine would reverse onto the front of the train and take it away.
There would therefore seem to be two possible alternatives in making use of the sidings. Either the engine runs around the train and does its own shunting if that is allowed, or the steam special company goes to the expense of bringing in a shunter for the day. Either way, Southeastern might not entertain having the station tied up for the duration of these movements. Others may care to comment on this, Terry Nunn in particular is much more knowledgeable than I am on this stuff.
Digressing somewhat, the photo below is of Dover Priory back in 1876, with five locos in view. From left to right, this shows the goods shed, then the smoke blackened awning over the passenger platforms on the twin track mainline, then the long carriage shed, then the engine shed where the tall chimney is, then a loco on a spur which later became an Ordnance depot, then the elevated water tank on the far right of the photo with the water crane in front of the loco in the foreground. There were later further sidings on the left of the photo, where the carpark is today.
The water supply for the steam trains came from the elevated water tank which derived its contents from an adjacent well. It was later replaced by a taller structure on a steel frame. The well is still in existence and full details can be seen on Kent History Forum together with track diagrams (three pages).
http://www.kenthistoryforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=11193.0
Today, the steam specials pass through Dover and take water at Folkestone West where a water bowser is parked in the car park and hoses taken the short distance across the platform. The first few seconds of this You Tube video show the bowser.
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I watched Oliver Cromwell steam through Dover Priory some years ago and then raced over to Folkestone West and watched them taking on water. I would have thought that a water bowser could similarly be parked at the buffet end of Dover Priory station and hoses led directly across the platform in similar fashion. I suspect that the reason that they do not do this, and use Folkestone West in preference, is the difficulty of persuading Southeastern to release Platform 1 for the twenty minutes or so that this would take. However, this is purely guesswork and the station manager and the steam specials companies would be the people to ask.
- 19 August 2012 07:19187727Thanks Ed - very informative.
I'll have to go and talk again with the Station Manager.
Love the photos, the top one is very interesting.
Trouble is that when "progress" is made in train-transport (steam to diesel) and other changes, there isn't any thought about the future use and all the old track and many buildings are dismantled, or taken up.
Roger
