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    Sorry Bern I have taken Military discipline as I know others have on the forum, but I do not remember ever being whacked about.

    Getting up at 4 in the morning, running with a telegraph pole through mud and water, doing as I was dam well told without question yes and of course being shouted at face to face, but physical abuse no?

    If its discipline they lack then its discipline they need and prison will not give them that.

    As I first said I do not know the answers any more than any one else, I just think if they are under 25 then it is not too late to pump some discipline into them.

    If of course they have been found guilty of actually using the knife or gun then prison probably is the only answer.

    I just wonder how many more grieving parents we have to watch on T.V before these youngsters get the message that the gang and the knife & gun is not the answer.

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