Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
As I put on the Dover petition thread, I had an email from an ex-Dover man who came back to see a friend a short time ago and was so saddened by what he found here that he wrote to our MP.
He travelled round East Kent with his friend, visiting Towns like Herne Bay, Whitstable, Ramsgate, Sandwich, Deal and Dover and his friend said why is Dover so shabby looking and uncared for.
Following his visit, he wrote to Charlie Elphicke asking him to do something about it; Charlie replied to him (I don't know what he said though) and this chap recently wrote again to Charlie and me too - not sure how he heard about me.
I have written back to him and he has replied. I have now asked him if I can use his letter to try and get something done and he has said yes: here is his letter.
"Dear Mr Walkden
Please find attached letters I have written to Mr Elphicke. I wrote a similar letter about a year ago, for which I did receive a reply, but which failed to address my main issues concerning Dover's image.
I hope you will feel inspired to take some positive action towards improving the dire image of Dover that gives former Dovorians and visitors alike a disgraceful impression of what is now a significant cruise liner port , and a major initial entry point to Britain for visitors from the continent.
Yours sincerely
John Hannaford"
His letter to Charlie, read:
"Dear Mr Elphicke
I write as somebody who grew up in Dover for the first sixteen years of my life and attended Dover Grammar School in the top academic stream. I retain a certain nostalgia for Dover and periodically re-visit the town. I previously wrote to you about the appalling general state, and image presented, of Dover as a town, and about the future of the port and harbour. Thank you for responding to my letter, though you failed to address the criticisms expressed about several specific disagreeable aspects relating to the town's environment.
Having stayed in the area recently for a week with a cousin who is unfamiliar with the district, the issue became far more poignant. We also visited Deal, Sandwich, Canterbury, Folkestone, Margate and Ramsgate; afterwards, quite unprompted, my cousin observed that Dover was by far the 'scruffiest place' he saw in East Kent. He was especially surprised at this lack of civic pride, as there were two cruise liners moored at the Admiralty Pier which he assumed would otherwise be likely to produce extra trade and business within the town. I realise that for many years following WWII there has been the potential threat of the Channel Tunnel hanging over the town; however, the effects of the tunnel have not been as devastating as had been imagined, with currently plenty of cross-channel shipping.
I would therefore urge you and local councillors to make every effort to engender the desire to develop and smarten up the image of Dover for the benefit of both citizens and visitors.
Yours sincerely,
John Hannaford"
I wrote back:
"Good Afternoon John
Thank you for your email and attached letter to Charlie Elphicke regarding the state of Dover.
Sadly, I have to agree with you.
I first put myself forward as a Councillor in 2003 because I wanted to do something for the Town to improve its image and increase tourism.
Having moved here with my wife in 1994, from Barnet in Hertforshire, to run a guest house in the Folkestone Road, which we did very successfully from 1994 to 2002, I could see that Dover needed an upgrade and an image change, especially after the damage that the illegal immigrants did to Dover's reputation in the late 1990s.
I have tried and tried to badger, cajole and encourage the District and Town Councils to support the Town in a proper sense, but sadly they won't/can't.
I late 2005, I started the Dover Loyalty Scheme, taking over a dead scheme that had had no one working on it for over a year and just a very small number of members, all of whom who were thoroughly fed up with paying out good money for no benefit.
The scheme grew and grew till we had well over 60 odd members. I ran this scheme for two years, putting full-page monthly adverts in the Dover Express; I built up a good data-base of local people whose first choice was to shop in Dover and sent regular emails out to them all, advising them on public information, up and coming events, and local business news.
I could not get any financial or moral support from the District or Town Councils, nor Dover Harbour Board; I also approached Dover's Tourism body - The White Cliffs Country Tourism Association, but none of the above bodies would support my efforts to help develop and move the Town forward and so after two years, a lot of effort and quite a huge cost to myself - I wasn't taking any money from this venture and had to pay out some monthly full page adverts in the Dover Express (over £400 each time), I closed the initiative down.
I had many London Boroughs and Town Centre Management type of bodies around the Country contact me, asking about the Dover Loyalty Scheme, when I explained to them how it worked, they congratulated me and wanted to ask if they could use the model for their own Town/area, of course I said yes - sadly, as I said, I couldn't get any support from Dover bodies.
I worked on a number of initiatives to support the historic sites and attractions too, one of them "Passport to Leisure" was fully costed and every historic site and attraction across Dover District, wanted to be a member of this scheme, but I had to get the moral support from the Tourism body - WCCTA; I didn't need any money from them, just moral support, but they said we didn't need or want it, so it never got off the ground. I now see that Leeds Castle have started exactly the same scheme as mine. Other areas around the Country also operate them - but not Dover.
I have always supported the Town and spent much time working on initiatives and projects that would help move Dover forward and help the businesses move from surviving to thriving.
I was offered the position of Dover Business Support Manager by Dover Chamber of Commerce, but after 4 months of working unpaid (I should have been) I was sacked. I have never found out the true reason why I was dismissed.
I have also worked for the Channel Chamber of Commerce in a similar role, but after 4 months and being very succesful (in their words) they advised me at the end of April this year, that unless I could find funding to pay my salary by the end of May, then they could no longer employ me.
I went to see the Town Council; also the then Deputy Leader of Dover District Council to look at the various budgets to see if there were any that could release some funds, I also approached Dover Harbour Board (twice), but didn't get the courtesy of a reply from them.
Because I couldn't get any firm pledges of financial support, the Channel Chamber dismissed me (or whatever term is more appropriate) in early June. I would add that they did not support my initiatives and projects to move Dover forward and kept telling me so - they wanted to support business start-ups and rent out small business units and get young people on apprenticeships; all very laudable of course, but these do not help move Dover forward at all.
Now there is no one supporting the Town in any real sense - in any sense, real or not.
Around the time I was working on the Dover Loyalty Scheme, I started a Tourism Strategy for Dover, I also started on an Action Plan for Dover Town, both are incomplete and still on my laptop and will probably never see the light of day.
Dover has many big regeneration projects in the pipeline, which will, in time, make an enormous difference to the Town, but what is needed now, is to make Dover a cleaner, more smarter Town, one that welcomes visitors and residents alike. I know what should be done, but sadly no one supports me.
We also need to make Dover a destination - from a tourism point of view, not the to-it-and-through-it Town that it is now.
Those who have the authority to move Dover forward, don't seem to care and those who care, don't have the authority.
Sorry this has turned out to be a long email John, but you can see that I have a lot of passion for Dover and have really tried very hard over the years, but no one was and no one is, listening.
Kind Regards - hope you get a good reply from our MP.
Roger Walkden"
I know this is a public Forum, but I feel it is very important for Dover that something real and practical is done - I have tried long enough without success.
I have emailed the Leader of Dover District Council and Paul agrees with me; I will now send this to the Town Clerk at the Town Council and Dover Harbour Board. These are the three main bodies who are the biggest stakeholders.
Maybe I should have written to them first ?
Roger
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
ROGER;
I should start by asuming recent questiions on your outcome at the industrial tribe. have now been answered, and clear as it didn't get that far that your case couldn't have been strong enough, or im sure you would have taken the chamber on,
but moving onto the state of Dover, although there are some agencies working at the port to promote Dover it doesnt appear to be enough.
Of course there are so many agencies that could make a difference but dont, that it sad for us dovorians to watch the decline.
I'm pleased as you say roger that your leader agrees with you, and i look forward to hear of his initiatives to change things.
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
Guest 688- Registered: 16 Jul 2009
- Posts: 268
Good post Roger and good reply Keith.I think the only way to stem Dover's perceived decline is to try and attract a more varied economic base.However,how to draw up the strategy to do this, with an enterprise zone twenty miles away,will require a great deal of thought.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
I recently had some personal comments addressed to me about Dover and the Dovorians, about a lack of pride...
I was offended, I am Dovorian, and have done my share to promote proposals for local prosperity.
We people of Dover have expressed our views concerning urbanisation in Whitfield, which we generally don't want.
We don't want thousands more cars streaming into Dover from tens of thousands of new prospect Whitfield residents, which in Whitfield they don't want either, driving down Barton Road, Frith Road, Maison Dieu Road, past pour schools, pumping us full of pollution.
Civic pride!
What the people want, and what DDC wants, can be two different things!
What pride is left when you are told that it will be like that full stop?
However, I am NOT ashamed of Dover, and have no time for other people's complaints about our civic pride!
Guest 688- Registered: 16 Jul 2009
- Posts: 268
Dover is a perpetual idea Alexander,that resonates far beyond the now in many countries.Unfortunately, we live at this juncture in the towns long history,but cycles of economic growth and decline are never permanent.Have faith in the old lady and it will be rewarded.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
of course we should complain alex, it shows that we care.
the reason that we live here is that we love the place, that does not stop us being embarrassed by some of the sights that we and visitors see.
yesterday i walked by the river in pencester gardens and i was staggered by the level of take away food containers, crisp packets, drinks cans and bottles floating in it.
i decided not to take any snaps as it would have been too depressing to put on here.
roger, and others like him, work tirelessly to promote the town because they love it and want to see it at its best.
Guest 696- Registered: 31 Mar 2010
- Posts: 8,115
Of-course I'm not referring in any way to Roger in my post above, who certainly tries hard for Dover.
What I meant was, there have been various comments about Dover being worn-down, etc., and the latest comments, including some addressed to me recently, were about the people of Dover and a so-called lack of pride and even more.
That's where I find it becomes personal, when the people are being referred to as negative.
Has anyone ever bothered to come and thank us for the fact that the port-traffic passes through our town, we breathe in the pollution, do not get a penny revenue from it, would like to receive revenue from the Port, but don't get any, and yet have never, in all these years, ceased to sacrifice a part of our town for the greater benefit of trade and passage between Britain and Europe?
If they start picking on us people of Dover, with all the spending cuts going on and the lack of revenue to bring in local prosperity, then it becomes personal.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
i understand what you are saying alex but people go by what they are presented with.
if we went to another town we would judge the people on the state of it not the council.
the worst litter(besides the stuff in the river) is cigarette ends, may i remind my fellow smokers that poundland are now selling portable ashtrays that are designed to fit onto keyrings.
forget the price though.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
Very droll Howard.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,942
i go with howard
lets complain if we feel the need
everyone wants the best for dover,
and frustration often creeps in
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS