Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#1
Some of you may have read on page 12 of the Dover Express about a claim by local historian Lorraine Sencicle, that her not winning a civic award was unfair; she also claimed that the present and previous Town Clerks had knowingly violated the Nolan Principle of Public life.
Four separate cases of accusations were made against people, including Kent, District and Town Councillor Gordon Cowan - all were unanimously thrown out.
The sad thing is that Lorraine has worked very hard over many years, to bring Dover's history to light, for the benefit and enjoyment of many people and this, sadly, has done her (reputation) no good at all.
Hundreds, if not thousands of people in Dover and around the Country, do voluntary work for the community and do not want or ask for thanks or publicity.
The big question must be asked, how much has all this cost Dover's rate-payers ? Many thousands I'm sure.
No one is the winner, everyone is the loser, especially Lorraine and the Dover rate-payers.
Any thoughts ?
Roger
Guest 660- Registered: 14 Mar 2008
- Posts: 3,205
#2
Roger I have recieved e-mails from Lorraine since this started,and even had conversations with Mike Webb,an indepentant enquiry was started on this but unfortunately the man holding the enquiry mistakenly sent a e-mail to Lorraine and had to resign.
A committee was set up by Dover Town Council,but this had to be changed as Lorraine had put a complaint in against Cllr Cowan,so 3 cllrs looked at the evidence.The complaint against Cllr Cowan was thrown out twice on appeal.
To put it simple no evidence was found that Lorraine had ever been nominated,although she says she has the evidence at the bank or with her solicitor,she claims that a man now dead nominated her.This is not an ideal situation because the nominations are meant to be secret so as not to lead to someone being nominated and not being excepted then feeling agrieved by it.Lorraine has declined the offer to meet with the Town Clerk or the Town Council which is of course her right.
The answer I think is simple if Lorraine can produce something that the Town Council appear not to have then a copy should be sent,or someone could nominate Lorraine again.
I was not on the Town Council when this happened but know the back ground mainly through Lorraine's e-mails and I am not involved directly but know there may be a court case as it looks as if people may start suing other people so can not comment further.
If you knew what I know,we would both be in trouble!
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
#3
This is a very delicate one. One must be very cautious posting on this thread now that it has started..as its very sensitive. Let me just add this bit...
...as I understand it and I am not a councillor, but I too have seen the documents as they have been sent to me. When someone is nominated, again as I understand it, it doesnt mean that the award is automatically granted. Thats why it is originally supposed to be kept secret.
I havent seen the newspaper story as yet but will do.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
#4
Nominated doesn't mean getting, and sadly throwing toys of of the pram like this isn't exactly going to persuade anyone to change their mind
Lots of people do good stuff for the community, but not everyone jumps up and down wanting a 'medal'.
Been nice knowing you :)
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#5
these things are not always the best kept secrets, i have received a copy of the knighthoods being handed out on new years day.
one of our members is a recipient but i am too modest to say who it is.
Guest 656- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 2,262
#6
Howard, your secret santa 'me' will keep quiet on this knighthood too
'
Brian Dixon
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#7
the same thing happend a few years back when the dwp project was handed to another person apart from the person mentiond in post 1.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#8
As Mike and Lorraine are both friends of mine I find this all a little difficult as I have had my ears bashed from both sides.
I would just say that a public body investigating a complaint against itself is unlikely to reach a conclusion which both sides would regard as fair.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
#9
that was the first thing that crossed my mind, i would have thought an independent arbitration body would have been a better idea and to the satisfaction of all parties.
Guest 651- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 5,673
#10
I'd rather forget about the whole thing, how much is it costing and how much more could it cost just because someone is upset that they didn't get their 'badge'.
Get over it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Been nice knowing you :)
Jan Higgins
- Location: Dover
- Registered: 5 Jul 2010
- Posts: 13,931
#11
I admit this is the first time I have heard of this.
How very sad that somebody thinks they are actually entitled to any honour and would publicly complain if they do not get what they hoped for.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I try to be neutral and polite but it is hard and getting even more difficult at times.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
#12
I think it would be too easy to get sucked into this without the full facts. Although I would comment that the cost might be something to consider...........
I am mindful, as well, that it is not always wise to believe "facts" presented by either newspapers (local or otherwise) or local authorities, who have their own spin on things. We only see the details that are presented to us, and there are clearly other factors to any story. That is emphatically not to cast aspertions on anyone or any organisations - just an observation or two. This thread has the potential to become very nasty.
Brian Dixon- Location: Dover
- Registered: 23 Sep 2008
- Posts: 23,940
#13
pram and throwing toys spring to mind.hopefully it will go away in a few months.
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
#14
Lorraine has always worked for the best interest of Dover with her historical findings and research. After receiving most if not all of the emails sent and received, my view is that it should never have reached the level it did; I have the highest regard for Mike Webb; the new Town Clerk cannot be blamed for anything at all, no one at the Town Council - officer or councillor received a nomination paper for her, so end of story - or it should have been, now it must be laid to rest, but what a waste of time and money.
Peace be among you all.
Roger
Keith Sansum1
- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#15
I hope my few comments can be aded now that im no longer if the local govt merry go round lol
lorriane does work hard for Dover and her stories on past years are second to none.
but knowing we all have faults, lorrian's is that is if people disagree with her she decides to complain or use other routes as she doesnt get her way.
I agree with ROGER on this one this latest episode is undoing alot of the good work that lorrain does.
As has been said there are lots of people around the communities who work hard and dont expect any blue peter badges.
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS
#16
It might be prudent to let this one lie, now.......?
Guest 687- Registered: 2 Jun 2009
- Posts: 513
#17
I must agree with Keith, Lorrine will attack you most vociferously if you don't agree with her, and I hve been the victim of her angst on many occassions, however the Civic Award should be based on what someone has done for Dover and not their personlity and I and two other recent Mayors would quite willingly endorse Lorraine's name being put forward for the award.
Guest 710- Registered: 28 Feb 2011
- Posts: 6,950
#18
May I too add my endorsement of this lady to be added to the esteemed list of staunch friends of Dover, as for page after page in Google the two names are already closely linked.
Ignorance is bliss, bliss is happiness, I am happy...to draw your attention to the possible connectivity in the foregoing.
Guest 698- Registered: 28 May 2010
- Posts: 8,664
#19
Yes Ken I would agree wholeheartedly with that.
I'm an optimist. But I'm an optimist who takes my raincoat - Harold Wilson
Keith Sansum1- Location: london
- Registered: 25 Aug 2010
- Posts: 23,948
#20
ken and peter
ALL POSTS ARE MY OWN PERSONAL VIEWS