Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
15 January 2010
21:0937781#1
In another post Tory council leader P Watkins has indicated his dislike of the cabinet system.
Cllr Watkins also indicated his preferance would be the committee system that was in place prior to the cabinet coming into being.
I have checked this out and there is nothing stopping cllr Watkins putting a motion to full council to go back to the committee system.
We have through the latest toilets fiasco seen how undemocratic the cabinet system is,
So I challenge you cllr Watkins put a motion to the next full council bringing back the committee system.
We will then see you are true to your word.
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
15 January 2010
21:1437784#2
Good one Keith but that will not happen but if it did would the cabinet members stop geting the ex cash they get now,I think it is £7000+that would go down to about £4500 I might not be right on this one but if I am it would be a saving help keep the looes open.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
15 January 2010
21:3337793#3
keith
have been checking back on posts on the bogs thread.
in posts 165 and 166 it looks like you and paul the fuhrer both agreed that the government brought in the cabinet system.
would our local elected representatives be empowered to change that?
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
15 January 2010
21:5337801#4
It would howard, take a lot of the electorate to achieve it, if they could.
Where as Cllr Watkins could do it at next full council
and he says hes all for committee system so a lot easier.
Sue Nicholas- Location: river
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 6,025
15 January 2010
23:5637823#5
Would not like to disagree with you Keith ,but my understanding is this was a directive from government .Dont you recall we could have had the Elected mayor system .Do you know of a council which has the committee system still All councils in Kent are cabinet system .
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
08:5337838#6
Would be nice like Mr Collor in other posts, to have a direct reply from Mr Watkins, i think if its possible we should go for it, and lobby in this direction.
If the council with its 3 political parties all in agreement went to govt stating it wanted the committee system and lobbied in that direction sure it would come about of course you have to have heart set on truely wanting that system to enable you to fight for it.
Over to you Paul
Guest 693- Registered: 12 Nov 2009
- Posts: 1,266
16 January 2010
11:0537855#7
I think Paul Watkins is an honest, upfront Councillor doing as good a job as he can. Given the financial constraints that all councils must be feeling, given that you can't please all the people all of the time, and given that councils are seen as fair game for people to blame all their ills upon, being Council Leader is a difficult and demanding post that will always attract critics.
Be fair, then, Keef! The committee system - or lack thereof - is not about what Paul Watkins may or may not want personally, it's about what central Government tells unitary authorities they shall do, a state dictate if you will. The present system is plainly wrong - this wretched toilets issue shows that - and some gross errors have been made recently, but please don't go gunslinging in Cllr Watkins' direction, it's plainly more than a situation one man can resolve.
True friends stab you in the front.
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
16 January 2010
11:4037864#8
quite right andy, the government has decided on the cabinet system, the opposition are in agreement.
what it has to do with paul watkins and nigel collor is beyond me.
lobbying from one council to government would be pointless.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
13:2537887#9
Looks like then we should all pack our bags and leave?????
no not at all, I clearly stated in my last posting if the 3 political leaders on DDC come to agree the committee system is what they believe in, then lets push for it, that 45 cllrs not 1 !!!!
But clear leadership on it and bottle to go through with it is required.
What we need to stop is decisions like these being made in the future
whoever makes them
Guest 640- Registered: 21 Apr 2007
- Posts: 7,819
16 January 2010
13:3237893#10
Its certainly clear that a number of councillors feel excluded from the decision making process, not only has it been said on here but a number have said it to me out around the town. Just what the answer is Im not sure, but it must be remembered that the excluded councillors are our representatives and have no voice, but anyway it could and would be better for everyone if there was more communication from those inside that closed door, that would do for a start. An explanation into the thinking behind the decisions early on, would very often stem the tide of furore people feel later.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
13:3737894#11
Paulb
this is correct, could have been dealt with far better.
Just on decision making in general, the cabinet allows officers and 1 cllr to make decisions with no reference to anyone, democracy???? no chance.
The committee system had lay representatives (public)sit on many of the committee's and able to speak, opposed by the conservatives at the time.
As I keep saying this is not about who made the decision, or about who should pay
Its about DEMOCRACY
Guest 653- Registered: 13 Mar 2008
- Posts: 10,540
16 January 2010
19:2337940#12
Keith - you go on about democracy, which I believe in too. Democracy is where everyone has a chance or opportunity to vote on issues.
The British people have an opportunity to vote - at election times and they vote for those elected representatives to act on their behalf.
The Labour Government are supposed to believe in democracy too, but did they give us the opportunity to vote on a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty ? No they didn't.
Was that because we're not intelligent or knowledgeable enough to know to vote the right way - their way ?
Cabinet and Executive decisions are NOT made by one person - as you well know.
I agree with Howard that one Council wanting to have a committee system, would be futile.
Roger
Guest 649- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 14,118
16 January 2010
19:3437941#13
Roger come off it old mate,do you think the blues will gave us a vote on the E,U.. it is a no to that,and please do not say it is to late because it is not .U.K.I.P. would do just that.
Guest 674- Registered: 25 Jun 2008
- Posts: 3,391
16 January 2010
19:5837946#14
Sorry heres onebloke not ready to pack his bagsor cave in, so becauseother councils dont havecommitteesystem then Dover shouldn't bother?
If the latest episode isanything to go by, agood case can be put to any political colour on the desperate needto get rid of this undemocratic system.
Sadly Roger, no I do not know who made thisd decision apart from ourNIGEL and sadly he chooses not to justify it.
Ia think Dover has a strong case to take to Govt
howard mcsweeney1- Location: Dover
- Registered: 12 Mar 2008
- Posts: 62,352
16 January 2010
21:1137960#15
keith
if one council took a petition to downing street over such a thing, that town would be seen as a laughing stock.
dover has enough problems with image as it is.
much i can understand "backbench" councillors frustrations at being left in the dark on final decision making, there are still meetings of full council for everyone to air their views.
if all local councillors around the country had exercised responsibility in the debating chamber, instead of point scoring and trying to get one over on a rival, then the cabinet system would not have been brought in.
16 January 2010
22:4337973#16
This has become a monster because of one thing: rotten communication. Ok, maybe two things if you include the original crass decision to close toilets!!